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Topic ClosedWording glitches in some in-game texts

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Eddy View Drop Down
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Joined: 29 Sep 2012
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Mar 2013 at 14:39
Originally posted by Eddy Eddy wrote:

In the "Sovereignty Held by this Town" tab, with my Armourer's fold open, the "Sovereign Structure Details" tell me the upkeep includes as much food as any of the other basic resources. Below this, the "Sovereign Structure Build Options" box shows what an upgrade would cost me, along with the upgraded structure's resource costs: but it doesn't mention the food. While the cost of building the upgrade may involve no food, the cost of running after the upgrade certainly does: this should surely be shown !


Further investigation reveals that, in fact, there really is no food cost to the upkeep of sovereign structures, regardless of what the Details box claims.
On the "Resource Production and Consumption" tab, the other basic resources have a deduction for "Sovereignty Upkeep" (along with similar for (at least) Trade Office, Runemaster's Grounding and Geomancer's Retreat, when applicable; all of these get mentioned in the "Others" box, which has no entry for sovereign structures), but food does not.
In one of my cities, I'm currently building up a Renderer, which claims to have a food upkeep cost: but the city's food deficit stood at -154 before I started building the Renderer (this city has enough food stored to endure a few hundred in deficit for years) and that hadn't changed when Renderer I completed (with an alleged food cost of 150, that should have taken my deficit to 304).

So I think the the "Sovereign Structure Details" table is simply lying, probably as a consequence of matching the form of the "Location Details" table immediately to its left. It's nice and pretty and all, but it's wrong. Either that or you have a bug and are failing to take into account the food costs of sovereign structure upkeep.

     Eddy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Mar 2013 at 07:00
On sending a messenger to recall an army, I get an IGM whose first line looks like: "Your messenger from City arrived at [@l=123|456|7." It fails to close the square brackets, so the @l token isn't rendered as the location-link that was intended.

     Eddy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2013 at 13:18
There are inconsistencies in how different buildings report the benefits that result from upgrading them. It's OK that some say "this much per level" in the text (when it's that simple) while others state the present and next levels' benefits in the summary table, but I see at least two ways (that look the same but have different semantics) of doing the latter's "at next level" part and several buildings that do neither.

I'm upgrading my Cancery of Estates from level 3 to level 4. It says: "Decrease cost of sov by +6%" and "At next level +4%". (Elsewhere, another that's not being built reports "At next level +2%".) First, a decrease by "+6%" is oddly (though technically validly) phrased; a + usually means an increase. Worse, because it has the same form as the next level's value, the latter appears to mean "we'll be decreasing cost of sov by +4% at next level" which isn't as good as where I am - why am I levelling up ?! - where I suppose it means we'll be decreasing the cost of sov by 10% (i.e. (6+4)%) at next level. Giving the change, relative to present level, in the decrease in cost is confusing and different from other buildings, e.g. the Flourmill reports "Food production bonus +18%" and "At next level +20%" (not the +2% difference, as the chancery reports).

I think it would make sense to say: "Decrease cost of Sov by 6%" and "Decrease cost of Sov by 10%" without the + and giving the final value: that's closer to what other buildings do for increases, except that I think it's best to drop the "+" when talking about a decrease - it's superfluous and, in this case, confusing. Alternatively, simply omit this information from the summary area: the text above makes quite clear that the benefit is 2% per level, in any case.

I see the Geomancer's Retreat and Runemaster's Grounding (both increases) do also report the change from level to level, instead of the benefit I'll enjoy at the next level. I can hazard a guess that the various units' quarters (rest, repose, somnolence, etc.) might do the same, but I've not build them to know. I find the flourmill's way of reporting this (also seen in storehouses, warehouses, basic resource production plots and the other basic resource enhancers) more intelligible !

The Spearsmith, Bowyer and Swordsmith don't tell me how much they improve the speed of production of fancy weapons; nor do the Leather and Chain armourers for fancy armour. They probably should, either in the text or at the top right of the summary. The primary production facilities tell me about their 4.5% per level, in the text. As an alternative to the specialists all saying they improve at 2% per level (if I've got that right), the production facilities could mention this where they explain about specialists increasing the facility's repertoire.

The Consulate and Barracks tell me that they decreases the time to train units, but not by how much. It looks like speed of caravan recruitment depends on market level, cotter on number of cottages, guild harvesters on level of relevant guild; but none of these says anything to that effect.

The unit production pages for Marketplace, Consulate and Barracks tell me the level of the relevant building. The equipment production pages (Book Binder, Blacksmith, etc.) don't; it'd be nice if they did. (The Item Production summary page does tell me each facility's level, but the facility's own page doesn't.)

The production speeds for weapons and armour come with helpful (?) icons (in the Info column) that I can hover to get an explanation; but the Marketplace, Consulate and Barracks don't do the same for their unit production rates. They probably should.

The Info icons' on-hover displays talk about "Effective Building Level"; it might be better to say which building is relevant, in each case, e.g. "Effective Chain Armourer Level", at least for the Blacksmith's texts, where swordsmith and chain armourer are variously relevant for different items. In any case, this would make clear the distinction between things where the relevant level is the production facility and things where it's the associated specialist. For primary production facilities, I can only build one of each in a town, so "Effective" is irrelevant: that only applies where I can have several of a specialist. So "Blacksmith Level" but "Effective Chain Armourer Level".

The on-hover for Sword in my level 20 Blacksmith tells me the "Production Time Breakdown". It has columns "+%", "p/h" and "Time". The Base is 1 p/h, a time of 1h. The effective building level is 20, for a 90% improvement. This is in fact a 90% decrease in the production time, not a 90% increase (as the "+" in "+%" might make one think) in the rate of production (it's actually a 900% increase in the rate of production, although 100*(1/(1-x/100) -1) isn't usually equal to 10*x). For small f, an f% decrease in time is (to a decent approximation) an f% increase in rate, but once f gets into two digits it isn't small any more and 100*(1/(1-f/100) -1) becomes discernibly distinct from f.

Placing a "+%" column (suggesting an increase) next to the p/h column (which does indeed increase), creates the impression that the p/h column should increase in the given proportion, when actually it's the inverse of the Time column, which has decreased by the given proportion. It would be better to have "−%", "Time" and "p/h" columns (in this order), since Time is indeed reduced by the indicated percentage; and rate (p/h) is merely a derived quantity, inferred from the (suitably reduced) Time. This would even have the bonus of placing the Time and p/h columns in the same order as the Time and Per hour columns just to the left of the Info I'm hovering.

     Eddy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2013 at 13:55
… but, of course, it's more complex than that. Production bonuses from the facility are reductions in the time taken to produce, whereas those from sovereignty are increases in the rate of production. So, to work through an example, my cattle production on a level 19 common ground with 76% of sovereignty support looks like:
Base: rate 0.86/h, Time 1h 10m
Time reduced by (level = 19)*(4.5 per level)% = 85.5%, to 14.5% of base time, is 70m*.145 = (7+2.8+.35)m = 10m (60*.15)s = 10m 9s.
(Note that increasing the rate by 85.5% to 1.855*0.86/h = 1.5953/h isn't the same thing.)
This implies a rate of 5.91/h, which is then increased by 76% to 1.76*5.91/h = 10.4/h. (Again, not the same as reducing the time by 76% of what remains (so to 24% of 10m 9s), to 0.24*(10m 9s) = 2m (24+1.8+.36)s = 2m 26.16s for a rate of 24.6/h.) So each cow takes 1h/10.4 = 5m 46s to produce.
So some of our modifiers are reducing the time, others increasing the rate; and I see the one that the modifier actually acted on is rendered bold in the on-hover table. It might be better, then, to have a table with p/h and time columns in the middle and separate +% (on p/h's side) and −% (on time's side) columns.

     Eddy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2013 at 22:32
Glitch in giant beetle images: [@c=337] is the giant beetle heart, but has the appearance of an exoskeleton or carapace; while [@c=338] is the giant beetle carapace, with strange curved shape with knobs on it that's the same of various other critters' hearts. So I think you have the heart and carapace images swapped !

     Eddy.
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