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tansiraine View Drop Down
Wordsmith
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Points: 172 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tansiraine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan 2014 at 00:17
My two cents.. I been buying stuff cause i too lazy to get it out of my hubs.. i know i know bad tansi.. but the stuff is cheap give it 6 months when it expensive to buy anything...Looking today saddles are cheaper then when the war started so why not buy them save the stockpiles for when ya really really need them... just saying
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Elmindra View Drop Down
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Points: 464 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elmindra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 23:46
You can maintain 200% sov with 60% taxes at all times with everything in the green, enough to maintain at minimum 30k T2 cavalry and still be positive in gold.  During non-war times, you simply switch to cow/saddle sov.  Saddles and/or cows sell so well that they make more gold than taxes with no troops.  Gold isn't only produced by itself, but also by selling excess resources of the T1 AND T2 variety.
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Sloter View Drop Down
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Also hoarding weapons and gold in peace time and keeping only medium size army is probably best way to go.It is expensive to keep max size army in peace time on burden of gold and weapon production while keeping medium size army and making huge surplus of weapons and gold can pay off when war comes.
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Sloter View Drop Down
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Points: 304 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sloter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 19:42
Epidemic military account uses 16-20 L2 sovs only in war, and when in war nobody would have any interest in keeping high taxes since troops that are produce usually die within 10-15 days after they are made so there is not much need for high taxes.

If you mean war time situation it is posible to keep 16-20 L2 sovs without any time limit,with low taxes offcorse.Lodging buildings are demolished within first days of war after initial reserv of troops is lost to get more basic res income to suport sovs.Non stop production of weapons and troops is harder but it can be done if all cities make every type of weapon while 2 different types of troops are made in towns for exmpl s t2 pears and t1 bows for elfs- 5 cities making t2 spears and 5 making t1 bows, or even 3 types of troops if needed.Any weapon not used like plate armor for exmpl can be sold and additional weapon can be bought to keep production going.
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Epidemic View Drop Down
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Points: 768 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epidemic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 19:15
Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

Originally posted by Epidemic Epidemic wrote:

Its just not possible to sustain a military account, on its own, permanently in this game.

What do I mean by a military account; 16-20 L2 or higher troop sov claims, 2 or more troop lodgings, non-stop production, large amount of troops, high taxes, 2 or more geo magic effect, in every single town.


 
There is a solution, it is pretty easy and obvious, but since it is you I will let you find it by yourself LOL



I see you didn't prove me wrong, as usual, lol.
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Ander View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

 
... I said that you cannot have the sov, the buildings AND the 100000 troops in one city, without that eventually going negative and devouring the gold ( and possibly the basic  resources as well) of other cities to stay alive.

I do not think that anyone disagrees with that ... so all I did is run some possible scenarios and give some cost estimates. Smile

No, you are not getting it. You cannot have 100,000 troops without sovereignty. Your cost estimates fall apart because you are considering all the factors separately while they are interlinked. 

Say, you have a geomancer city that you run at low tax to have enough mana to support your spells. That could as well be an ideal city to have two Marksmen's billets and run a +300% troop production. You may not need food sov there as your tax is low and more pop doesn't bring you much extra gold. You are not loosing anything in this setup.

You can have enough resources to feed 2 archers billets and 2 geomancers and +12,000 resource production to supply your sovereignty, without help from other cities. 
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Deranzin View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:

 

I had a +296% in Mimosa with two cavalry parades and all resources positive - the city is still there - you can look it up.
 


This is the only Mimosa in Illyriad :
http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/World/Map/385/-491

Can't see any such sov though Tongue

Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:

Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

 
If you are so interested in knowing HOW it is done and how much it costs, ask Halcyon

No need, I do that. That is why I am sure of the numbers. 

All resource positive my friend, and no feeder cities. Big smile



No 6 digit number of troops though ... ( and I know that because in the last war you sent me your cavalry early on Wink )

I never argued that you cannot have the sov and the buildings while keeping a positive income (if you read the previous page you will see that I said that myself) ... I said that you cannot have the sov, the buildings AND the 100000 troops in one city, without that eventually going negative and devouring the gold ( and possibly the basic  resources as well) of other cities to stay alive.

I do not think that anyone disagrees with that ... so all I did is run some possible scenarios and give some cost estimates. Smile
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Ander View Drop Down
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Points: 1269 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 16:20
Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

 
If you are so interested in knowing HOW it is done and how much it costs, ask Halcyon

No need, I do that. That is why I am sure of the numbers. 

All resource positive my friend, and no feeder cities. Big smile
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Ander View Drop Down
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Points: 1269 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 16:14
Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:

 
Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:

 
Add a 45% reduction from two cavalry parade grounds, you would have spent only 600K gold in 232 days while producing the 100K knights.


That is why I said initially that the parameters are many and I was not much in the mood to calculate it ...

2 Cavalry parades need resources as well ... the tweaking involved to make 300% sov production, with the cavalry parades and how much you will produce before it becomes cost ineffective or when to apply a 3rd cavalry parade or destroy one of them ... these and many things more are needed to be considered and I am not up to it atm.
 

I had a +296% in Mimosa with two cavalry parades and all resources positive - the city is still there - you can look it up.

Originally posted by Deranzin Deranzin wrote:

Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:


Not 10, just about 3 cities.

A 7 food city running at 20% spell and 40% sovereignty boost on food can produce 67106 gold at 85% tax. Assuming that the 8 immediate squares around the city are of 5 food sovereignty, the cost of sovereignty will be 4820 gold.


Cool ... but this result in those cities having no armies and we are back to Sloter's very good post on page 2. Wink
 

Sloter's post was about cities running at 20x level 5 sov, which is a different matter. 

Some of Sloter's cities may be newly built after the last war reparation, but you could look up his older cities and decide for yourself what sovereignty they may run at. Wink 
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Points: 845 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deranzin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 16:11
Originally posted by Ander Ander wrote:

 
The three biggest alliances on the anti-coalition side doesn't have training alliances (i could be wrong). So they cannot be supplying too many cities using alts from training alliances?

Almost every alliance on the coalition's side has training alliances. T?, DiL, ARM, T-P, NS. I am not saying that there are alts in these alliances supporting the war. Just pointing out that that if you believe troop sovereignty is linked to feeder accounts, this is something where that belief should clash.


Look here, I wanted to have a theoretical discussion on costs ... if you want to talk the actual war, find another person to do that.

As the matter stands you do not need other alliances (training or otherwise) to do the tricks Elmindra has been describing ... not only most of the big players have enough resources to run the queues themselves, but in terms of sov all you need is other towns to feed your own ...

If you are so interested in knowing HOW it is done and how much it costs, ask Halcyon (he passed through this topic, else I wouldn't have mentioned him) how he sustains 6-digit number of troops in his 29000 population desert cities surrounded by 0 food sov. Wink

http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/World/Map/-942/-279

And a nice stream of caravans going in and out atm ... nice "coincidence" LOL
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