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Topic Closedwar {P A} vs S&B
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StJude View Drop Down
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Points: 568 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:27
Originally posted by Nokigon Nokigon wrote:

You don't seem to see HM's point. Nothing is proof! What you have to do is decide whether you believe the mail is genuine, which clearly you don't. I do. You have your opinion, I have mine. End of?


There are two ideas being debated here from what I can see.

My main objection specifically to HM is his use of the word "solid" in the phrase "solid a source of evidence." That word "solid" did not imply that HM was ever saying that nothing is proof.

What has happened now, and very skillfully, is that HM has demonstrated that even a screenshotted mail can be fabricated. If this were a court of law, the jury would be VERY hard pressed, given the evidence presented to find Borg guilty of running more accounts than two.

The "masses" are ALL basing their opinion off of 1 email. Others, through faulty logic are then concluding, that if the masses (who's only source is now a suspect screenshot) say this is true, are now simply agreeing, because they heard it enough times.

Like Rill said, anyone could make an accusation in Illyriad and if they can convince enough of the populace to get on board, some poor player could get screwed over by the angry mob with pitchforks


Edited by StJude - 07 Aug 2011 at 19:28
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SunStorm View Drop Down
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Points: 979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:35
Originally posted by SunStorm SunStorm wrote:

This issue is no longer about Borg sitting Zork2010.  Borg is also a sat account (probably same sitter as Zork2010).  They will both be gone soon...

LoL  (^_^)  I posted that without providing proof just to get people stirred up a little....  MUA HA HA HA HA  (I know, I really shouldn't have...)

When have you know of me to post something WITHOUT having my proof.  I will post the chat log below where Borg admits to being a sat account.  Then, for further proof, I have uploaded the video from GC where it is stated.  

When are people gonna learn...  *sigh*


[01:09]<Borg> you declared war on me
[01:09]<Vecinu86> yes TD
[01:09]<Gratch> Oh, in that case, why?
[01:09]<The_Dude> okie dokie
[01:10]<SunStorm> borg - you began hostilities....
[01:10]<Borg> S&B did nothing to your alliance
[01:10]<SunStorm> (~_~)
[01:10]<artorious> Borg you attacked us using an account you were sitting.
[01:10]<Vecinu86> Boru? can you be more specific?
[01:10]<Borg> you decalre war, its a green light to attack
[01:10]*Douger eats some cheese
[01:10]<Borg> i like fighting at your town instead of mine
[01:11]<Fluffy> Borg, i heard you started attacks
[01:11]<Borg> i did nothing
[01:11]<artorious> ya he did through an account he was sitting
[01:11]<SunStorm> well thanks for that - better defenses on our ends then
[01:11]<Fluffy> oh sorry, not Borg, i mean Zorg...
[01:11]<Fluffy> zork?
[01:11]<SunStorm> zork
[01:11]<Fluffy> something
[01:11]<Fluffy> yeah
[01:11]<SunStorm> 2010
[01:11]<Fluffy> close enough at this point
[01:11]<Vecinu86> Zork2010
[01:11]<Vecinu86> hmmm
[01:12]<The_Dude> Is Vec seeing the bigger picture
[01:12]<Borg> ....
[01:12]*Vecinu86 am I seeing the big picture? happy, :)
[01:12]<SassyVixen> so if there a spot on the map with a pink ring that says neutral occupying forces is this an npc?
[01:12]<SassyVixen> or player
[01:13]<Gratch> npc
[01:13]<The_Dude> am you, Vec?
[01:13]<ZellZero> night night all its 1am and im tired as anything
[01:13]<The_Dude> happy, :)
[01:13]<The_Dude> nn ZZ
[01:13]<Kojak> Night Zell
[01:13]<Lorre> brog ya better drop the sitting accounts before those changes come in play otherwise ya might find urself with an account at all
[01:13]<Vecinu86> "am you" ?
[01:13]<Vecinu86> happy, :)
[01:14]<SassyVixen> ty so all pink is npc
[01:14]<Douger> yes
[01:14]<The_Dude> yes SV
[01:14]<Borg> this account is being sat
[01:14]<SassyVixen> ty td
[01:14]<The_Dude> by whom, Borg
[01:14]<Borg> that, i will not say
[01:14]<Fluffy> zork tongue, :P
[01:14]<The_Dude> why not?
[01:15]<SunStorm> then it also should be "removed"
[01:15]<SunStorm> and apparently it will - soon
[01:15]<Cookies> afternoon all
[01:15]<Borg> it will be, in 90 days or so
[01:15]<SunStorm> with the new game sitting rules
[01:15]<Kojak> Hi Cookies
[01:15]<artorious> me wonders if Borg is Lion heartz?
[01:15]<The_Dude> Borg will go by the system.
[01:15]<The_Dude> But Zork2010?
[01:15]<SunStorm> so you start this with a bunch of inactives cause you can....
[01:15]<Kojak> Hi artor........
[01:15]<SunStorm> is all of S&B and TOW inactive?
[01:16]<Borg> nope


This link takes you to the video file:


I am renaming this war to:
"The War of the Inactives"

Edit:  Corrected a color problem - nothing more (^_^)
Edit:  Added a quote to my original post on the matter.


Edited by SunStorm - 07 Aug 2011 at 19:50
"Side? I am on nobody's side because nobody is on my side" ~LoTR
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Rill View Drop Down
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Points: 6903 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:54
I want to clarify that I was not questioning the accuracy of statements regarding zork/borg being played by the same player.  I myself saw a chat fail that indicated this is the case.  I was saying this sort of allegation should not be made (or perhaps should not be believed by the community) without evidence.

As for the type of evidence, I think it's appropriate to weight the statements of witnesses as well as documentation like that above.

For the people who are concerned about pitchfork-wielding mobs, my experience in Illy has demonstrated that the community is unusually thoughtful and weighs statements and evidence carefully.  The discussion in this thread tends to confirm that -- people are evaluating statements and weighing what constitutes demonstration of an allegation.

Well done Illyrians!
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Kurfist View Drop Down
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Points: 824 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 20:10
I'm getting tired of this,
if you have a problem on how these people conduct their actions then speak up in the Illyriad way, " take up arms against".  other then that, theres nothing more you can do by complaining and whining about how the evidence used isnt fair evidence,  This isn;t the real world where we have teams of investigators examining every small thing.


Edited by Kurfist - 07 Aug 2011 at 20:11
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The Duke View Drop Down
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Points: 464 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 21:32
Kudos to SunSorm for providing irrefutable evidence to the jury here.
"Our generation has had no Great Depression, no Great War. Our war is spiritual. Our depression is our lives."
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Llyorn Of Jaensch View Drop Down
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Points: 924 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2011 at 00:10
Originally posted by Aneirin Aneirin wrote:

Sgt Shanks says she has seen a mail. Nokigon has said that he has seen it but this is not evidence . It is hearsay.

It's no good telling those players who believe integrity that "Multitudes have seen it" so there is no need to produce a mail.  People don't want hearsay that is just as bad as spreading a false rumour.. People want integrity and proof.


Hearsay: is information gathered by one person from another person concerning some event, condition, or thing of which the first person had no direct experience.

Your stupidity is confusing you. These people witnessed the mail, which is absolutely by any measure credible evidence. This is by definition and your own words not hearsay.

Correcting you is getting exhausting.
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lorre View Drop Down
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Points: 446 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2011 at 02:12
again i started this thread to inform why this was happening.nothing else,if some people really have to keep going on about showing evidence then tell me this why? this thread was not started to ask for help so why should i post any further explanation or any evidence inhere?
the war started for what i said in my first post.
ww1 started cuz some archduke got shot people didnt ask for proof they had the facts why it started.
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Leungarific View Drop Down
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Points: 114 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2011 at 04:16
Probably gonna catch flak for this, but it's gotta be done:



Now tell me I faked that screenshot, Jude. You know you want to.
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Kurfist View Drop Down
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Points: 824 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2011 at 04:32
I'm curious, my firefox top is blue, how did you get yours green?
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Leungarific View Drop Down
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Points: 114 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2011 at 04:44
An attempt, although this might get shifted to technical help forum ._.

Windows - Desktop--> Properties -->Appearances-->Scheme/Effects.


Edited by Leungarific - 08 Aug 2011 at 05:09
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