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The Duke 
Forum Warrior 
Joined: 22 Jul 2011 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 464 |
 Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 21:32 |
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Kudos to SunSorm for providing irrefutable evidence to the jury here.
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"Our generation has had no Great Depression, no Great War. Our war is spiritual. Our depression is our lives."
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Kurfist
Postmaster 
Joined: 14 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 824 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 20:10 |
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I'm getting tired of this,
if you have a problem on how these people conduct their actions then speak up in the Illyriad way, " take up arms against". other then that, theres nothing more you can do by complaining and whining about how the evidence used isnt fair evidence, This isn;t the real world where we have teams of investigators examining every small thing. Edited by Kurfist - 07 Aug 2011 at 20:11 |
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Patience is a virtue, resource giving is a sin
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Rill
Postmaster General 
Player Council - Geographer Joined: 17 Jun 2011 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 6903 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:54 |
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I want to clarify that I was not questioning the accuracy of statements regarding zork/borg being played by the same player. I myself saw a chat fail that indicated this is the case. I was saying this sort of allegation should not be made (or perhaps should not be believed by the community) without evidence.
As for the type of evidence, I think it's appropriate to weight the statements of witnesses as well as documentation like that above. For the people who are concerned about pitchfork-wielding mobs, my experience in Illy has demonstrated that the community is unusually thoughtful and weighs statements and evidence carefully. The discussion in this thread tends to confirm that -- people are evaluating statements and weighing what constitutes demonstration of an allegation. Well done Illyrians!
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SunStorm
Postmaster
Joined: 01 Apr 2011 Location: "Look Up" Status: Offline Points: 979 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:35 |
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LoL (^_^) I posted that without providing proof just to get people stirred up a little.... MUA HA HA HA HA (I know, I really shouldn't have...) When have you know of me to post something WITHOUT having my proof. I will post the chat log below where Borg admits to being a sat account. Then, for further proof, I have uploaded the video from GC where it is stated. When are people gonna learn... *sigh* This link takes you to the video file: I am renaming this war to: "The War of the Inactives" Edit: Corrected a color problem - nothing more (^_^) Edit: Added a quote to my original post on the matter.
Edited by SunStorm - 07 Aug 2011 at 19:50 |
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StJude
Postmaster
Joined: 12 Jun 2011 Status: Offline Points: 568 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:27 |
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There are two ideas being debated here from what I can see. My main objection specifically to HM is his use of the word "solid" in the phrase "solid a source of evidence." That word "solid" did not imply that HM was ever saying that nothing is proof. What has happened now, and very skillfully, is that HM has demonstrated that even a screenshotted mail can be fabricated. If this were a court of law, the jury would be VERY hard pressed, given the evidence presented to find Borg guilty of running more accounts than two. The "masses" are ALL basing their opinion off of 1 email. Others, through faulty logic are then concluding, that if the masses (who's only source is now a suspect screenshot) say this is true, are now simply agreeing, because they heard it enough times. Like Rill said, anyone could make an accusation in Illyriad and if they can convince enough of the populace to get on board, some poor player could get screwed over by the angry mob with pitchforks Edited by StJude - 07 Aug 2011 at 19:28 |
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Aneirin
Wordsmith
Joined: 28 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 186 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:25 |
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Hello HM Thank you for revealing your hitherto unknown ability to forge screenshots. No doubt this talent at forgery will be noted by many outside of H? The point made by Rill and Celebcalen in this thread is that allegations on issues such multiple accounts, which question a players integrity, shouldn't be spread without some sort of proof or evidence. Sgt Shanks says she has seen a mail. Nokigon has said that he has seen it but this is not evidence . It is hearsay. It's no good telling those players who believe integrity that "Multitudes have seen it" so there is no need to produce a mail. People don't want hearsay that is just as bad as spreading a false rumour.. People want integrity and proof. If Lorre has a mail he should back up his claims that the Zork account is being wrongly used. If he does not then he cannot be believed and his allegations are as fraudulent as the screenshot that you produced in the above posting! Whatever happened to simple honesty?
Edited by Aneirin - 07 Aug 2011 at 19:27 |
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Smoking GNU
Forum Warrior
Joined: 12 Jun 2010 Location: Windhoek Status: Offline Points: 313 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:22 |
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Obviously not, Nok. Jude is the Troll of choice these days.
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Nokigon
Postmaster General
Player Council - Historian Joined: 07 Nov 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1452 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:08 |
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You don't seem to see HM's point. Nothing is proof! What you have to do is decide whether you believe the mail is genuine, which clearly you don't. I do. You have your opinion, I have mine. End of?
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StJude
Postmaster
Joined: 12 Jun 2011 Status: Offline Points: 568 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 19:00 |
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It took you 44mins to respond, I doubt that it took under 3mins.
That said 44mins is not a whole of time either and I would have been content with that. I'll put it to you this way then. Hearsay and text, and now by your own demonstration, screenshots are not the basis to make an accusation and then say "I have PROOF" At this point, who is now to say, (I love that you did this btw) that what Lorre has is proof? It is all still in the realm of conjecture and speculation. And....your point is still a fallacy of logic. Just because some folks SAY it is true, does not MAKE it true. Now, is the evidence compelling? Now I am not so sure.....you just did a great job showing that even the screenshot forwarded to the GC Police is suspect. |
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HonoredMule
Postmaster General
Joined: 05 Mar 2010 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1650 |
Posted: 07 Aug 2011 at 18:22 |
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Ok, here's one from that message you sent me 3 days ago. honoredsoft.com/fake_screenshot.png Editing the page, taking the screenshot, and highlighting the details/cleansing sensitive parts took less than 3 minutes total. |
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"Apparently, quoting me is a 'thing' now."
- HonoredMule |
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SunStorm wrote:
