| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
The_Dragon 
Greenhorn
Joined: 03 Apr 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 103
|
 Topic: War game or not?
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 05:11 |
 Rill wrote:
Angrim wrote:
peace is not a right. peace takes work. |
+1
Thank you for this.
|
Yes, peace takes work. You can get peace through your soldiers, you also can get peace through talks that backed by your soldiers. No soldiers, no peace. This is what happened in RL, this is also what happened in Illyriad.
|
 |
AdamTheGreat
Greenhorn
Joined: 09 Sep 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 52
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 03:28 |
|
I prefer this game as a trading and gathering game, and slaughtering animals, but not destroying each others cities.
|
|
Sinn Fein "Ourselves Alone"
|
|
Rill
Postmaster General
Player Council - Geographer
Joined: 17 Jun 2011
Location: California
Status: Offline
Points: 6903
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 03:23 |
Angrim wrote:
peace is not a right. peace takes work. |
+1
Thank you for this.
Edited by Rill - 13 Oct 2012 at 03:24
|
|
KillerPoodle
Postmaster General
Joined: 23 Feb 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 1853
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 03:18 |
|
Or choose a beach where they don't hand out catapults as part of joining the club.
|
|
"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM
"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill
|
|
Angrim
Postmaster General
Joined: 02 Nov 2011
Location: Laoshin
Status: Offline
Points: 1173
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 02:14 |
Rill wrote:
The boy who shot a catapult at someone else's castle without that person's permission is indeed reflecting something of himself. So is the person who is surprised that such people exist. (We call that naivete.) |
i wonder if this doesn't miss the point. without more information, we must consider that shooting a catapult at someone else's castle may be exactly the purpose of the beach. we simply don't know. the children on the beach must decide what constitutes fair behaviour, and if they do not they will resort to tribalism and vendetta to interact, much as illy does when the norms break down (e.g., rare resources).
peace is not a right. peace takes work. i hear players complain about the politics in illyriad. they should understand that the politics that take place in peace are, for long periods, the very things that avert war. the irritating conventions that keep each player from doing just as he or she pleases are the very things that keep the illyriad server unnaturally free of conflict. those conventions are formed of agreements and compromises made over successive hours by players who love peace and are prepared to put in the time to achieve it.
in times of conflict it must be considered that one player's justice is another's bullying. the actions are often the same, and in the absence of a prearranged moral consensus, only the players involved can know their own motivations.
|
|
JimJams
Forum Warrior
Joined: 20 Sep 2011
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 496
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 00:09 |
LordOfTheSwamp wrote:
The debate seems miss placed to me - sorry to be a pedant, but...
The question is not whether the game *is* a wargame.
The only thing that Illy absolutely 100% *is* is a building game. Because if you sign up and then refuse to ever build a building, you can do *nothing*. So, you have to build.
After that 1) It COULD BE a war game for you. 2) It COULD BE a trading game for you. (You could actually stop building as soon as you had a trader in a Hub, and just play the trading only, and I'm sure that if I got into it I could spend longer with the trade system than I now do with troops.) 3) And to a lesser degree it could be about crafting, exploration, magic, etc. as YOU choose (as people like Scribes play it.)
Lets unpack the wargame aspect of it. Once you have decided to play the game as a wargame, you can then choose: 1a) It COULD be a PvE wargame for you. (But not with much interest at present.) 1b) It COULD be a consensual PvP game. (This is how I play it. And I can attest that this is WAY more fun that facing the steamroller of a bunch of vets.) 1c) It COULD be a non-consensual PvP game.
What is unique about 1c is that this choice alone - and it is a choice - can rob other people of their choices.
If in KP's analogy, I am presented with a toy catapult as I walk on to a beach, then I have the choice of whether or not to take it and if so what else to do with it. (I could do all sorts of things with it - re-engineer it to make it better, set up my own targets to shoot it at, whatever - or I could do something else on the beach.)
Kurdruk
PS Ander - "A boy is building sandcastles on a beach. You go and kick down his castle. You could say that it only reflects how you play with sandcastles. Others may(or may not) think it reflects who you are." That is not only true, it's actually profoundly thought-provoking. Do you mind if I steal it?
|
Some game have a pvp flag, and can be really played with different styles. This one doesn't have a pvp flag, so, you can decide not to use armies or even build them, but you are still pvp on, and could not be surprised if a neighbor send you thieves or armies...
What makes the game interesting is the metagame which made possible to play those peaceful styles with great chances to survive happily. This makes this game great.
But, as it is possible to make war, it is ALSO a war game.
|
|
|
|
JimJams
Forum Warrior
Joined: 20 Sep 2011
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 496
|
Posted: 13 Oct 2012 at 00:04 |
Ander wrote:
A boy is building sandcastles on a beach. You go and kick down his castle.
You could say that it only reflects how you play with sandcastles. Others may(or may not) think it reflects who you are.
|
Another one mixing real life with games.
Edited by JimJams - 13 Oct 2012 at 00:11
|
|
|
|
The_Dude
Postmaster General
Joined: 06 Apr 2010
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 2396
|
Posted: 12 Oct 2012 at 21:30 |
Llyorn Of Jaensch wrote:
Lets see how many threads we can make to discuss the same thing and chase our tails?
Im betting.....moooooore.
|
3 threads started today, right? On top of the countless existing threads on this topic. There is nothing to say that hasn't been said.
|
|
Llyorn Of Jaensch
Postmaster
Joined: 31 Mar 2010
Location: Sydney
Status: Offline
Points: 924
|
Posted: 12 Oct 2012 at 21:21 |
|
Lets see how many threads we can make to discuss the same thing and chase our tails?
Im betting.....moooooore.
|
|
"ouch...best of luck."
HonoredMule
|
|
The_Dragon
Greenhorn
Joined: 03 Apr 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 103
|
Posted: 12 Oct 2012 at 19:35 |
Kurdruk, please understand that there are no player who is more powerful from devs. If devs allow us to attack other players city then all players have to be ready to get attacked. You can protect yourself by building your troops or rely on your friends' troops but please don't say to your aggressor that you may not attack my city.
For example, I don't harvest, I don't craft. Is that mean that I can complain if someone attack me with troops that use crafted weapons? Can I disallow them to use crafted weapons against me? I am not more powerful than Devs, if devs allow other players to attack me by crafted weapons then I have to accept that.
|
|
Tweet
War game or not?
