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Topic ClosedVarious kinds of Sov structures, on 1 Sov square

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Mandarins31 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Various kinds of Sov structures, on 1 Sov square
    Posted: 24 Apr 2012 at 13:34
yes, that is also what i thought. 

I think that kind of modification of the current sovereinty system would really add some potential to it. Hope it will happen some day :)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2012 at 14:52
I was thinking that any number of structures on one sov location should count as one "structure," i.e. the limit would be clarified as number of sov tiles that can have structures on them.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2012 at 19:57
HM, to make those B.ress consumming structures stack up as if it was of 1 kind is a very good idea. 

In your exemple of 3 food  + 2 jousting (lets say repeatedon 8 squares), it would avoid to unclaim those 8 lvl 5 sovs to lvl 3 (to put food sov), and then claim 8 other lvl 2 for Jousting yards a bit farer, which is fastidious.
What i see now, describing this exemple, is that it would give some advantage from what it is currently, in terms of gold and research consumption, as then you can build more structures on the closest squares... but i personnally think this advantage from current system would be reasonnable... it would certainly permit to build only few more lvls of sov structures.

About the 20 sov structures limitation, you were thinking about counting 3farmyards+2jousting yards on a same sov claim as 1 or as 2 sov structures?


Edited by Mandarins31 - 22 Apr 2012 at 19:59
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2012 at 18:34
You could make the basic resource upkeep stack so that there is no savings.  For example, 2 levels of Jousting Yard + 2 levels of Finishing School could be made to cost the same as 4 levels of either one.  The total cost would be determined by the total count of basic-resource-costing levels.

There would still be a benefit, but a very fair one:  You could fully utilize a level 5 sovereignty claim with a couple levels of Jousting Yard and three levels of Food sovereignty, and the cost would be manageable.  That way, you'd get to do a more proper job of using your 20 "sov building" limit but wouldn't be able to stack the high-value structures in a cost-avoiding way, preserving reasonable limits on how much production bonus you can have at one city.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2012 at 18:18
Originally posted by Auraya Auraya wrote:

what if you could only have one type of sov but could build up others on the square and switch between them when necessary? 
 

I think that's an interesting concept. though, it would only be interesting for sovs which do not ask a basic ressources unkeep, as farmstead, erthworks, etc... as you wouldnt replace a lvl 5 farmstead by a lvl 5 Jounsting yard for exemple (as its not wise to have high lvl of those). So by switching, you would fall with a lvl 5 sov claim with a lvl 2-3 jousting yard (which is better in terms of B.ress consumption) on it... and you woud certainly want to unclaim your sov as you are paying 2-3 lvl of claim for nothing... If you are limited by Research production, you will certainly do so, justly to reduce the sov unkeep and to be able to put more taxes for exemple... this is this process that i find too exhausting, and which enables to react fast to certain needs. 

Of course, you can demolish the sov structures already and rebuild the ones you want (that's time and ressource consumming already, but that is fine, and think that should be the only requirement to change your sov structures, once you've claim your lands already)... but as i explained, the lvl of sov claim you will have wouldnt often fit with the kind of sov structure you would want to put on it. 

The real unwanted benefit having various sov structures on the same sov claim, is indeed as it would generally low the Basic ressources unkeep of certain sov structures. 


Im thinking, an other way to make that enchanced flexibility possible, would to keep things as they are, but to have a system which permits to Unclaim and Claim lands much faster, once you've reached lvl 5 of claim on a certain land, and didnt lost that land so far or didnt receive any hostile troops starting to claim it so far. 



Edited by Mandarins31 - 22 Apr 2012 at 18:22
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2012 at 01:06
It's a nice idea but I'm not sure it would ever get implemented because of the impact it would have. As Rill says, by splitting the sov structures up you would make it more profitable to have 5x level 1 structures. You also wouldn't have to choose between good attributes - for example, +6% food bonus or +1% livestock?  

I've thought about it quite a bit because I do think the idea has merit.. a variation on this idea.. what if you could only have one type of sov but could build up others on the square and switch between them when necessary? 

For example, I have level 5 food sov active and level 5 bowyer sov built but unactive. I can then choose to deactivate the food sov and activate the bow sov, making it a lot quicker to switch. There would most likely need to be some sort of cost attached (e.g. +5% basic res upkeep for each structure, to limit players from just building everything) but it would give versatility - and it would still take the same amount of time to build up in the first place and require an army sat on the square for extensive periods. I might make a new thread for this variation.. although it still might have a negative impact on the game balance. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2012 at 19:35
this would massively increase the economic benefits of sovereignty (by lowering sov costs).  Not sure how that would affect the ephemeral thing the devs call "balance."
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2012 at 18:53
accceptible to me but how do u calculate outgo of basics for such sov structure.

I mean i can build 5 level 1 cattle ranchers on sov 5. do i pay 150 basics each for same? 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2012 at 15:03


Well, that's just an idea that came to me while i was trying to work my sov wishes with their Research unkeep... and also, i was thinking about the current lack of flexibility of the sov structures

So, what if we could have various sov structures on a same sov square claimed?

Though, we would still have a max lvl 5 for Sov squares claimed, and then, we would still be able to put 5 lvl of sov structures on it... but why should it be only of 1 kind, while those lands are so big? :)


As an exemple, you have a lvl 5 sov claim. Instead of putting a lvl 5 Farmstead on it, you could put a lvl 3 farmstead and a lvl 2 Cattle rancher... or have 1 lvl 1 Training ground, 1 lvl 2 Earthworks, 1 lvl 1 Bowyer, 1 lvl 1 Bladesmith.... etc...

Also, maybe be able to build the same kind of building twice? (though, as it would add a real beneffit in terms of basic ressources consumption, that would be questionable)

The interest would be to add more flexibility. If for exemple you have 8 lvl 5 sov claims, and if you want one day to readapt your city to a certain circoumstance, and want for exemple to produce les Food, but more Livestock, Leather and more Ranged units for exemple, you currently have to lvl back those lvl 5 claims, and then claim some other lands (which is fairly long if you have to adaptate to a particuliar situation... and making this in all of you cities...). You have to do so as those Adv.ress sov structures ask you more and more (too much) basic ress/lvl when they are over lvl 2.

To follow the possiblity to put various times the same kind of structures... the questionable advantage is that you would have, for exemple, 2lvl2 + 1lvl1 jousting yards, instead of 1lvl 5... so 720 ressources consumption instead of 2400... that's why i put it as an optional feature of that idea :p


To sum up, all i would like is to be able, once, you claimed a square, which is already long, to be able to change the sov structures on it (which is also ressources and time consumming) at your wish, without having to unclaim, re-claim, re-unclaim, re-re-claim... and then make your city more fast responding, permitting some new kind of specialisations and tactics which are currently broke by the current work and excessive time it asks.

Would it be an acceptable idea?

M31


Edit: Forgot to precise, that, with this idea, instead of being limited in 20 sov Structures, we would be limited in 20 sov claims on which we could build sov structures... of course. And that this idea would bring small advantages in terms of Gold and research consumptions from how it is now, imo.





Edited by Mandarins31 - 21 Apr 2012 at 15:08
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