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abstractdream View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abstractdream Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2013 at 12:40
Epidemic
Refer to Angrim's post

Ander
Your assumption seems accurate to me. EE and nCrow (and vCrow too) have something to gain by doing the very thing they and others have accused me and mine of for more than two years.

The numbers may be spot on but TVM cannot withdraw. We did not get in. We were declared on by all three and are being forced to fight. That is not to say we are unable to accept a "die by the sword" mentality, however it is now clear that the rhetoric of our opponents in general is just lip service. The opportune entry of vCrow to "free up" their allies and nCrow to preemptively protect their member flies in the face of everything they have espoused in the time I have been active in Illy.

I am not sacrificing my friends. I am sacrificing my own account. The rest of TVM is sacrificing theirs. I have never expected anything less while being a part of a group of players who recognized the ethereal quality of the "things" they've built while cherishing the actual relationships above all else. I have sent a few messages out explaining the alternatives to staying and fighting and so far only a handful have taken any one of those routes. Their heads are where they need to be.

Our efforts are for our own peace of mind. Any benefit to Harmless? is bonus for them, not the goal. Also, if we are helping them, I wouldn't post that here.

EDIT: put the player names where they belong.

Edited by abstractdream - 24 Nov 2013 at 12:46
Bonfyr Verboo
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Vanerin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Vanerin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 04:31
Quote one group of players to stay out of the conflicts that arose between players as time went on. Harmless? represented that group well, but now it is more than only them. 
On the other side is a group of players who want to limit or even eliminate conflict, regardless of who is involved.

I would suggest looking at the diplomacy history of the "Non-Interference" group . How frequently have they declared war on other players? I know that for several alliances in the "Meddlers' group", this is their first time going to war.

Also, wouldn't trying to change the nature/existence of either group be considered "interfering"?

Personally I think those labels are rather silly. This is a multiplayer game and interacting and interfering are not easily distinguished. Any action taken by anyone could fall under either/both of those labels depending on the perspective.

~Vanerin

P.S. For future reference, I think you kinda accomplished the opposite of the intended goal with the font-size thing. It was have been *much* easier to read if more words could have been seen at one time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daufer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 07:45
Originally posted by Vanerin Vanerin wrote:

P.S. For future reference, I think you kinda accomplished the opposite of the intended goal with the font-size thing. It was have been *much* easier to read if more words could have been seen at one time.

Actually I like the large print.  Being a bit older and not that sharp-eyed anymore It didn't cause me a headache like most of this forum BS does.  Maybe a smidgen smaller next time though if you please.  This looks about right to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote AZADICAN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 10:02
Bonfyr,

Could you explain honestly why you have declared war to Valar last war? It is still a question to me. 

Just a short answer with ANY reason will do.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geofrey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 14:50
I applaud you for posting your perspective. 

However large bold font does not further your cause. 

You could of simply said you enjoy the smaller conflicts of illyriad, and support Harmless?s agenda of continuing smaller scale conflicts. And you oppose Consone's attempt at no conflict, as well as other alliances attempting to prevent all conflict. 



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Darkwords Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 16:20
So 2 or 3 weeks after the coalition claimed that uCrow did not 'have the right' to defend their allies, and Kumo was claiming he had ensured the peace that pervades in Elgea, you are claiming that you will fight to the bitter end for this coalition as they maintain the 'right for people to fight'.

When will this so-called coalition stop twisting and turning in their propaganda campaigns?

This is not to criticize you for staunchly fighting, however only time will tell if those who you blindly follow will show such courage and honour and of course it'll be too late for you or your members by then.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abstractdream Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 17:31
Vanerin
Those labels are your own. All I said was one group wanted to stay out of other's conflicts and the other group wanted to limit conflicts. Also, I never said the group that wants to stay out didn't want to get into their own. BTW: how do I see "diplomacy history"?

The font is a personal preference and apparently another divisive issue. Huh...

Azadican
We were about to siege a VALAR city so... As for why, refer to my OP.

Geofrey
I said what I had on my mind. Take it or leave it.

Darkwords
I don't have any issue with uCrow other than they wanted to escalate the war and that seems counter to the way Crows present themselves.

I am following no one. I have allies. They can do as try please just as I have. TVM may go down but it is because EE decided to attack, vCrow, Shade and nCrow followed suit. What's that got to do with my allies? I believe it is because they didn't want us to be able to help when they began to attack them. The only other reason I can think of is revenge for EE, I don't know what for vCrow and Shade (though one of them said to free up EE) and a preemptive strike for nCrow. I'll entertain counter theories.
Bonfyr Verboo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sloter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 20:12
I am also , same as AZADICAN curious as to why did you declare war on Valar in last big war.I checked your OP but i dont see any info about that there, or maybe i have missed it.Could you also give some date of your war declaration to Valar.I remember that Valar cities were under heavy attack by H? in west area and by NC in central areas so i would be thankful if you you could give me estimated date of your siege of Valar city so i can form picture of what happened when.

Also if it is posible could you please say why you sieged  cities of Druids?

I am also interested to know what happened with TLR, why was TVM formed in such way (players leaving TLR and their leader and forming new alliance) Do i remember corectly that TLR and its leader at the time decided to withdrow TLR from war under presure from one other alliance and as result TVM was formed so that all ex TLR players would have way to continue war?

I know all this is probably ancient history to many but i can not miss oportunity to ask question since you offered to answer.It is ok if you decide not to answer them, it was worth asking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darkwords Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 20:47
Originally posted by abstractdream abstractdream wrote:



Darkwords
I don't have any issue with uCrow other than they wanted to escalate the war and that seems counter to the way Crows present themselves.

I am following no one. I have allies. They can do as try please just as I have. TVM may go down but it is because EE decided to attack, vCrow, Shade and nCrow followed suit. What's that got to do with my allies? I believe it is because they didn't want us to be able to help when they began to attack them. The only other reason I can think of is revenge for EE, I don't know what for vCrow and Shade (though one of them said to free up EE) and a preemptive strike for nCrow. I'll entertain counter theories.


My question was in regards to why this thread claims that vCrow et al stand against warfare in this game and that the coalition try to create an environment where people can go to war, when quite the opposite is evident.

The coalition exist to maintain a system where their member alliances can go to war against unprepared targets, whilst non-member alliances are told they will be destroyed by H if they join in to defend such targets.

The other side (the crowalition as I would like to term us, thats not to put the importance on all the non-crow alliances down, just a nice play on words) stands for their right to fight, their right to defend their own allies and their right to play the game free of another's control.

From what is stated in the opening post here, it sounds like TVM should be fighting with us, not against us.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brandmeister Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2013 at 21:08
Originally posted by Sloter Sloter wrote:

I am also interested to know what happened with TLR, why was TVM formed in such way (players leaving TLR and their leader and forming new alliance)

Eternal Fire gives me a chuckle sometimes, but I'm hardly surprised that he could inspire a mutiny.
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