Trade Improvements 2

Brandmesiter So hubs are active and you had to do a lot of work to figure out which ones are and which are not and we should just take your word for it?  But it does seem to me that if you were to share that information we would all be able to increase our trading because we wouldn't have to send everything to Centrum.  Of course we could all do, as you have done, build a lot of traders and send them out as scouts so we can find out what you found out, and maybe in the spirit of competition that's a good idea.  But since you are basing your position on the evidence you have gathered, I'm not sure in the spirit  of fair debate you shouldn't share that information.  Sort of reminds me of McCarthy saying "I have right here in my briefcase proof that Communist have infiltrated to the highest levels of our government"  then refusing to share that info for "national security reasons."  Of course, thankfully the seriousness of this information you possess isn't nearly like that...but still, same principle.  If you make a claim based on certain evidence you should be willing to put forth that evidence, that's just plain how things are done when you enter into a debate.

If I've over-generalized your position, I apologize, but it still seems to me you are arguing for a centralized market because a centralized market offers more contact points between buyers and sellers than having those points distributed across all of the hubs.  This makes sense to me as well.  However, it is, I think, a short sighted approach as if the contact points were more evenly distributed they would remain the same number or more as more people would actually become traders (not needing to be close to Centrum to do so would encourage this, I believe) and the time it takes to actually deliver goods drops.  

As for the "churn" theory,  denying it does not make it false.  The logic of doing more transactions more quickly simply means more opportunities for profit.  Thus, it is to a players benefit to distribute at least the more common items across the entire hub network.  If I had your information I might be able to show that this is false under the current case because of some statistical anomalies or something, but since I don't we have reached the point of saying: "Is too!" "Is Not!"  It doesn't stand to reason to me that more transactions spread across a larger geographic area would result in less trade.  But your secret numbers tell otherwise?

As for the crafted items, their centralization in Centrum is not the problem, as I have stated elsewhere, it's that the value of the crafted item is so low it is seldom used...or to put it another way, crafted items do not have enough use value to make owning them particularly rewarding.  Thus, they appear worth a lot but are not central to the game.  This is reflected in my first post on trading.

Finally, you say that "there are situations where it makes sense to have particular markets be centralized" and then go on to list everything except for basic resources which, it seems to me, are very seldom actually bought and sold, but are distributed more because it's easier and faster to deliver them to people from a distributed network.  Again, though, I don't have your numbers to examine this assumption.  What I'm wondering is,  since hubs are used for both storage and distribution and for trade, what items, if any, do you think would benefit being traded on a more distributed basis?

Aj

One more thing.  In re-readying your response Brandmesiter, I do think you are correct that it would be good to use empirical evidence to determine the rate of trade per hub and compare that with Centrum.  You seem to have those numbers.  Could you send them to me?

My "empirical" numbers are limited to: 1) about 4-5 hubs I've sent a trader to and found nothing there...except perhaps Hope Ridge.  Maybe I hit the 4-5 hubs that have nothing in them and the rest are thriving and vibrant; and 2) the anecdotal evidence I've see here and in speaking with other players...albeit only about a dozen or so.  But, it must be said, of those with whom I have spoken, pretty close to all agree with me that hubs away from Centrum are under utilized as trading hubs.   But we can certainly settle this with your empirical data, so do share.

Thanks

Hubs are used way more for storage than trade.

My experience is that there is very little advanced resource trade outside Centrum but I don't really see it as a problem. I used to have buy offers for brown bear fur all across Elgea, in 5 0r 6 different trade hubs. In Centrum I offered 200-500 gold/fur less then in the other hubs. The offers in Centrum were filled within 2 weeks but the offers in all other hubs were still open when I moved my traders to broken lands.

Personally I think the main reason that trade is centralized in Centrum is that hub trade is sort of tedious and complicated.  I don't do hub trade when I can avoid it, and I wouldn't want to trade at a lot of hubs and repeat the process over and over.  Now, I am not a super active trader.  There are people who find it delightful to set hub orders and shuttle things back and forth to fulfill demand at various locations.  I probably would not be one of those people even if trade were not as cumbersome as it is.