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Gaius Rufius Tullus View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Non-Aligned Alliance Movement
    Posted: 30 Oct 2013 at 13:13
Originally posted by Badur Agamak Badur Agamak wrote:

Why not bring NAAM down to a local level? If all the alliances in Middle Kingdom for example come together as a unified body and elect a council made up of one member of each alliance in the area . The council would then discuss trade, military policies etc . That way a select few members of each area can debate if conflict arises in illyriad instead of everyone getting on the forum and having heated discussions that don't solve the conflict and result in it becoming personnel and people form vendetta's in their conflicts. This then leads to the destruction of cities and people leaving the game.
What do you think?

I personally love the idea, but that would surely mean moving members across the map to the alliance.  If someone would be willing to take me and covered my area (a city in Norweld and the rest in Keshalia) then I would run at them like a bouncy-ball possessed. Sadly there are not a lot of those alliances, but if there were.. I would try to join ASAP :)  You get something started and I'll join! (If it falls under the local category) Smile

Originally posted by ToWhomItMayConcern ToWhomItMayConcern wrote:

I thank the players of NAAM for clarifying to all of Illyriad the bully tactics of the said alliance they have decided to declare war on. 

It is a great idea for small alliances to group up in times of need to defend each other and rid themselves of aggressors.

When you say "rid themselves of aggressors", I hope you are not implying that we would kick the living [profane word] out of them. I just want to be nice and safe in a big world *enter Ms World/Universe Speech about world peace etc*

I for one do not want to push people out of the game, but would like to be free of the people harming other small alliances. I walk the line! Hug
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2013 at 05:05
I thank the players of NAAM for clarifying to all of Illyriad the bully tactics of the said alliance they have decided to declare war on.

It is a great idea for small alliances to group up in times of need to defend each other and rid themselves of aggressors.
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Meagh View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2013 at 03:05
Originally posted by Hora Hora wrote:

Would be interesting, but utopic if more than, let's say, two alliances are involved... Wink

This has been often proposed, sometimes tried, but small alliances don't want to listen, and big alliances don't need to... where war is cheap it always goes down to size of armies... sadly so.

Pleased to know that Tamarin is indeed utopia where the weather is always mild, the wine flows freely, the men act honorably and the women are always sexy and most active alliances work together under the The Lancetia treaty or a local agreement with the parties of that treaty (which is for mutual defense and trade only).

imho these confederations made to protect the little guy are silly. Smaller alliances need to understand that confederations are as much a liability as they are anything else. If you agree to aid another group militarily you can expect to find yourself in exactly the same situation as the non-alligned alliance movement [which just confuzzles this Dwarf... this whole the non-aligned alliance confederation thing... How can u be non aligned and neutral when you are in a large confederation (of smaller alliances?).]  To keep neutrality, a smaller group must avoid unnecessary liabilities and obligations. Take an ally or two and that's it - make it a big ally if you're worried about big groups unnecessarily battling you (which shouldn't be a worry if your small group is smart and has a strong active military).. but most important is to make it local and make your obligations defensive in nature so that you aren't drawn into any wars they get into...

finally, even with one or two confeds Hora is right.. size of armies does matter! But player numbers matter less (as Darmon points out). five or six good active members in one locality is a force to be reckoned with and it is respected locally (where it counts).  Diplomacy first but keep your axe sharp as I say. - M.


Edited by Meagh - 30 Oct 2013 at 03:08
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2013 at 02:58
Is population count really the best metric for relevant military strength?  Isn't it possible to be a huge player but have sub-par troop counts because you focus on other aspects of game play?  Maybe that analogy falters once you're talking about big alliances, because most players in those likely focus their attention on martial pursuits.

Also, I doubt any 2 alliances are exactly the same size.  So where do you draw the line?  How big of a difference does it have to be before you consider it bullying?  I imagine being able to agree on actual numbers might go a long way towards getting people to agree if impossible or unreasonably odds are involved in a conflict.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 22:41
Would be interesting, but utopic if more than, let's say, two alliances are involved... Wink

This has been often proposed, sometimes tried, but small alliances don't want to listen, and big alliances don't need to... where war is cheap it always goes down to size of armies... sadly so.
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Badur Agamak View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 22:29
Why not bring NAAM down to a local level? If all the alliances in Middle Kingdom for example come together as a unified body and elect a council made up of one member of each alliance in the area . The council would then discuss trade, military policies etc . That way a select few members of each area can debate if conflict arises in illyriad instead of everyone getting on the forum and having heated discussions that don't solve the conflict and result in it becoming personnel and people form vendetta's in their conflicts. This then leads to the destruction of cities and people leaving the game.
What do you think?
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Hora View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 22:01
Two sibblings in a sandbox throwing sand molds at each other, 

both running away crying 

and now their mothers start a fight (obviously with the aid of many expensive wannabe star lawyers, looking at the EE thread LOL)

...have fun! Thumbs Up
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Gaius Rufius Tullus View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 21:05
Originally posted by Tordenkaffen Tordenkaffen wrote:

Originally posted by Gaius Rufius Tullus Gaius Rufius Tullus wrote:


...
@Torden - NAAM has prepared, I am not sure in our military capabilities but we have troops.. Does that count? Cool

No. It annoys me to no end that you market yourselves as "the non aligned (neutral)" confederation - strongly implying to your average recruit, that the driving motivation is pacifism, and then drag your members into this war. The fact that they have joined you strongly implies they have NO CLUE about warfare, yet you are placing them in situations far beyond your own control.

So no, it doesn't count that they have troops, because everyone else have more. And I find it remarkably indifferent and irresponsible simply to place all those small accounts between yourself and the siege engines.

This is bad leadership, plain and simple.

Hey mate, I was against the name change from ECOSA and voted against it, I prefer the Elgean Confederation of Sovereign Alliances. That is not mismarketing now is it? I tried twice to change its name back, but what is a name (in this game)? Something to hide behind to justify your actions.

And the small accounts stay in the respective alliances, only those wanting to participate in the war have joined NAAM. Plus NAAM does not recruit, players can only join via a NAAM member alliance.  We never claim to be passive, that is inviting alliances to mistreat us - we try to be peaceful but even a.. I bet even butterflies get angry when constantly provoked ^^

Bad leadership would be something along the lines of... Well, there is no bad leadership - merely opinions. I have played these games and this game for a long time and have been in oligarchies, democracies, anarchies (great fun) and dictatorships. They can all work well and be fun!


Originally posted by DeathDealer89 DeathDealer89 wrote:

Oh wait thats what you guys formed to prevent.  So I guess the best way for you to prevent that now would be to disband.  The other option being just telling the truth on what you really stand for.

Like I said, I still want the name change to ECOSA, that would change nothing but the flag (which will not turn white) and will not ease your criticism either. So meh.  

You do however raise a point, and I may be under the false impression that NAAM fully disbands after the war and our goal has been reached.. I do hope we stick to the original agreement though.

But like Derazin stated "What laws of the server .?. This game is an open-ended sandbox, it has no "laws" apart from a "how to play" tutorial LOL"  That is the reason we are posting on this forum now. To justify yourself and seem in the right. 

I have done my fair share, so before criticizing again - justify your action/inaction first.

Though well done for the constructive criticism, have a link to a picture of a cake. http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2152/2218017260_961efa8e12.jpg
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 17:33
Originally posted by Binky the Berserker Binky the Berserker wrote:

the point of fair or unfair isn't the question. As long as everybody obeys the laws of the server it's fair. Ganging up 10 on 1 is fair, because it isn't forbidden.


What laws of the server .?. This game is an open-ended sandbox, it has no "laws" apart from a "how to play" tutorial LOL

And since when is Illyriad - you know, the game where the older members protect the newbies and send them stuff and help them grow (unlike most other games of this kind) - ruled by the ethics of power and might .?. Shocked Dead

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 17:23
Originally posted by Gaius Rufius Tullus Gaius Rufius Tullus wrote:

Say you are in a family group, and someone is beating your little sibling. Granted, you may be bigger than the bully - but that should not stop you from helping your younger sibling and stopping the conflict.
before further charges of hypocrisy begin...this is more or less the scenario that got NC into the war on the side of RE.  so at least two heads in this many-headed conflict have used this same rationale.  it should be clear to any who follow it to its natural conclusion that it ends when Elgea runs out of bigger, stronger alliances willing to assist their smaller kin.

it is not a moral failure to ask allies to assist one in time of crisis; it is not a moral failure to seek advantage in an armed conflict; and it is not impossible for a smaller alliance to act in a way that invites "fair" military retribution from a larger one.  where diplomacy is insufficient to settle an argument, there is war.  of ends to that, there are only victory and defeat, and they will occur on the map, not on the forum.

[23 Sep 2012 12:40]<Innoble> a fair fight is a fight both parties are dumb to start, so fair fights are fought by idiots

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