The State of the Community
Printed From: Illyriad
Category: Strategies, Guides & Help
Forum Name: General Questions
Forum Description: If your gameplay question isn't answered in the help files, please post it here.
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=5528
Printed Date: 16 Apr 2022 at 22:45
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: The State of the Community
Posted By: GM Rikoo
Subject: The State of the Community
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2014 at 01:39
|
Hello all, As the new community manager and public relations manager, I wanted to take a moment to go over exactly what my vision for the community (and press) is. The first order of business is to explain exactly what it is I do. What is a community manager? I am taking over for GM Luna, the last CM/PR. She left very nice, large shoes to fill, but she also left tons of great info and clarifications for me to explore. A community manager acts like the voices of the two sides of the game, the players and the developers. That means I take player concerns to the developers, and work with the developers to announce items or discuss changes with the community. That also means that I am not a coder; I will answer anything and everything I can but tech support questions. Those go into a petition so the coders can be let out of their cages long enough to fix them if possible. I also act as a moderator for the in-game chat and forums. If you have questions about moderation/rules, check out http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/code-of-conduct-rules-updated-102911_topic31.html" rel="nofollow - this thread and http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/chat-moderation-faq-clarification_topic3420.html" rel="nofollow - this one . You can also find them on my in-game profile. As usual, feel free to send me an in-game-message with any (and I mean any) questions about moderation. It is much better to ask me about moderation than to "hear" about how it works from players who might not know. (I have already had to shut down several "I heard"s!) What is a public relations director? It's a fancy term for someone who contacts the press, attempts to attract the press to the game/s and acts as the go-between for the press and developers. I also cover social media and write blogs/communications. When you see an article or coverage about one of Illyriad Games' games, that's due to the PR manager, usually. This is the part of the job that you players rarely see me doing because it's all done in emails and social media. Keep in mind one major thing before reading below: I can and will host community-based events, but things like tournaments are developer-based events. Community-based events do not, generally, require heavy coding or can require nothing but player participation. In other words, I can pull these off myself. OK, so what am I planning? Several things, but as is the general rule in game development (or should be) -- I will never tell you anything until it is practically ready to go. Why? Because gamers are horrible at the telephone game. That means if I say (as I have) that I am "thinking" of doing something for the community, it can (and has) turn into "He said it was today at 3:00 pm!" Having said that, there are a few things that I can talk about. 1) Host an in-game event: This can be something like the recent instant-on event that asked players to attack two separate towns. The idea was that there was a pack of thieves who stole from the King, and he needed the items returned. The player who did the most damage to the town's army won a medal from the King. During the event, the towns suffered from scores and scores of attacks. When it got down to it (and because we kitted the towns out with a small army) the player who got there first with an army won. This was more of a race than anything. In the future (and if the King approves it) I would like to add more to these events, like puzzles or trivia or something else on top of the attacking or robbing. Keep in mind that these will not always be announced and, so, some players might miss them. Generally, however, I will try to use social media/forums/chat to let everyone know. Sometimes I might just toss it out there! Be warned! I am not afraid to upset a few players for the sake of spontaneity! Frequency: once per month. 2) Reigniting the Player Spotlight: I am re-opening the player spotlight because it is a great way for the public and for the playerbase to get to know the game. I am looking into switching out the "reward" for players who are featured from a t-shirt from our shop to Prestige or something similar, or a choice of either. Frequency: once per month. 3) Hosting a Strategy Monday livestream: This is a great way to gather with players to discuss the finer points of the game. Illy, in truth, is like a giant, neverending strategy boardgame. With that comes a million ways to play, and a playerbase that is able to make the game how they want. These livestreams will be hosted by me but we have plans to include the rest of the developer team. If you would like to participate, http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/the-strategy-monday-livestream-thread_topic5521.html" rel="nofollow - check out this thread . Frequency: once per month. 4) Random contests/trivia/etc: These are quick, fun and easy ways to get involved with the community. I might ask trivia one night, host a poetry contest or (something I really want to do) host a player profile contest. I can hand out various "prizes" for these, but will hold off listing them off until I talk with the developers. Frequency: often, when I can, etc. The general idea is to have some "thing" happening once per week, on average. Again, bear in mind that these events have nothing generally to do with the developer events like tourneys, etc. When those come they will be treated in a different way altogether! If you have any ideas for a contest or event (and I have received a ton already) please put them in this thread, send them to me with an IGM or send to community@illyriad.co.uk ! Feel free to discuss all of this below. Many of you might have noticed, but we have been gaining tons of new players. This is due to coverage, other games shutting down, Age of Ascent's recent popularity and crossover, etc. Be welcoming to these new players because one day you might need a target! GM Rikoo
------------- Illyriad Community Manager / Public Relations / community@illyriad.co.uk |
Replies:
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2014 at 04:21
| I am glad to see your enthusiasm about building up the community and the game. Keep bringing in the newbs, so we can keep helping them grow! |
Posted By: Mayflower
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2014 at 04:56
|
I'm glad the King has acquired such a passionate GM! ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/105635" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Kabu
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2014 at 06:16
| I'm looking forward to those events being announced in the forums! |
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2014 at 10:27
Hmm ... but what is the average staying time for the newbies .?.  Anyway, your plans sound good, but I do not think that they can reverse the game's decline nor can they mitigate the problems generated by some gameplay issues that are critical. And with less and less veterans around, building an account from ground up is becoming a harder task everyday. I hope the plans work, but I am not very optimistic about it ... -------------   Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
GM Rikoo wrote:Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 11:03
|
Buying prestige or not does not seem to be the issue anymore ... I think that since most Illyriad players gave the new AoA game the cold shoulder (and with very good reasons I might add) the company reverted to a policy "hey we do not need them anyway" and started over-enforcing rules with unfathomable goals (I admit of not understanding the purpose of the latest ban fests and what Illyriad Games gain from them). What is most amazing of all is that they seem to be targeting players that are not ban-material and with targets like these the situation is going rapidly downhill ... ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: Auraya
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 13:20
|
If anyone has an issue with the new GM, you can always mail SC. I spoke to him recently and it appears that no-one who has actually been banned has sent him a message explaining the problem. I've always found him incredibly reassuring and willing to listen to any and all complaints. Regarding this: 'You could find yourself in deeper water by attempting to clear up the punishment than just dealing with it.' Providing you are respectful and willing to discuss things rationally, this should not be the case. The problems arise when you start raging at GMs. My advice would be to take a step back, grab a cup of tea, calm down and then write an IGM stating where you believe you have been treated unfairly. Have a friend read it before you send it, to make sure nothing sounds too unreasonable.
|
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 13:41
This is a very reasonable and sound advice concerning the people that have been punished ... alas a game or a commodity is not only comprised by the people that were (or feel like they were) wronged, but by other people as well ... As far as I am concerned I find the "grab and kick and shut up" policy quite on the "obviously bad PR" side ... when you are a GM and you are punishing someone, then you should have enough justification to do it and handle any public critique for it, since, presumably, you feel that you were right in your decision ... Imagine working somewhere where your direct superior could punish anyone he wanted and noone could even speak about it (I got reprimanded in GC because apparently even mentioning people that got punished is a punishable action in and of itself !!  ), would you say that this is a good environment to be working in .?. I don't think that anyone would, but heck in the example it is a workspace and many people put up with many weird situations in order to maintain their careers ... so, ok, let us say that such a behavior is something a superior in a job might get away with because the people working under him are afraid of their jobs ... but in a game where people participate to have fun ???Definitely back PR and definitely not fun, especially if you combine it with the already existent problems of the game ... in those circumstances I expect even more people bailing out of the game very soon and if the GMs do not care enough to notice something that obvious, I do not think that we have any business writting specific IGMs for that ... heck, things atm are so bad that I am a bit worried that I might get reprimanded/banned for this post here ... is that a gaming environment anymore, one has to wonder ... Edit: Wow, the posts were deleted ... now this dialogue seems pretty unjustified ahahahah ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: Hora
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 15:52
|
I personally never had any problems with any GMs... ..and I didn't turn GC on for quite a length of time (was it 1 or 2 years?), as talks in there can turn from silly into rough within minutes, especially at war times...  Perhaps Rikoo could outline his ban policy a bit, so we know what to expect... I football a strict ban policy is quite normal... state anything against a referee, and you'll get a warning or even cards... not sure if such would be good in here?  EDIT: Oh, yes, one post in between has been deleted... GM Luna used to leave notes, so the discussion hasn't a hole in it. Oh, and anyone still remebering GM Strategos Pink Pen of DOOM ?
 |
Posted By: GM Rikoo
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:01
|
Hora, The rules for both moderation, chat, etc are on my IG profile or here: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/code-of-conduct-rules-updated-102911_topic31.html http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/chat-moderation-faq-clarification_topic3420.html Let me know if you have any specific questions. As far as any deleted posts: when a player uses the forum to discuss issues that are between the GMs and them, it is not allowed to stick around. Any posts quoting or discussing that post need to go as well. We have always had a policy against discussing private dev/player interactions for various reasons. And I give warnings as well. :) Anyway, like I said holler if you have any questions about specific areas! GM Rikoo ------------- Illyriad Community Manager / Public Relations / community@illyriad.co.uk |
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:06
Me neither, but like it or not, they are shaping the environment we are called to interact within. Not having a personal problem with GMs or not being in danger of being banned myself (or so I think, ahahaha  , I do not think that this discussion is going to be very healthy for my future in here ) does not mean that I should not care when other people do have such problems ... if it meant something like that we should stop calling ourselves a "community".
Pay me a pro football players salary and I will put up with any number of referees, arbiters and whatnot ...
Two were deleted actually ... ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: Flavius Aetius
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:32
Two were deleted, one of them being mine. One was an aggressive stance on a moderator, the other was mine replying to that. I am not sure how mine warranted removal, since I did not get an explanation why. I was not largely sympathetic to the other person and her troubles until right about now. The players are expected to follow the code of conduct, I am sure we can all agree on that. But, antagonizing the players does not help anyone. Remember, the players are the consumers. The players have no obligation to remain loyal to the developers and continue buying their products if they find themselves being antagonized. Now, I'm not condoning we all start finding loopholes in what to talk about or how to act in GC, the forums or in the game. But, there are also consequences to "unfair" moderations.
|
Posted By: Auraya
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:37
| 3 actually - Twisty, Flav and Llwy. Just for clarification because I am pedantic like that. |
Posted By: Flavius Aetius
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:41
Your clarification is appreciated. :)
|
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 16:46
Yes, apparently I had missed Flavius' post ... sorry for the miscount. Apart from that :
I definitely do not understand this sudden passion the DEVs exhibit about sticking with the rules, especially over a community that is already quite aggravated with the lack of BL, lack of tournaments and the extremely slow handling of tech/bug petitions ... it is just making people actually angry, instead of simply irked and I cannot understand why they do it ...  ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: Lwyllyn
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 19:46
|
GM Rikoo- if you truly believe you are doing the right thing, then why delete an inoffensive post stating my position? A reply would be much better for PR. More mature, too. Also, at least some response to my IGM should be forthcoming. As for mailing GM Stormcrow- I would love to! But without a player profile, I was unable to contact him in-game. So, if someone would do me a favor, please IGM me and let me know how to get a message to him. Hurry! before this post is deleted, as well! Yes, the GC community has some issues today. Silencing voices will only exasperate them, and will solve nothing. |
Posted By: Neytiri
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 20:45
|
Tournament??? ------------- "It is well that their bodies know the heat and the cold; it will make them strong warriors and mothers." - Absaroke elder (from Edward S. Curtis's book 'The North American Indian') |
Posted By: Anjire
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2014 at 23:02
|
The Illyriad community is and has been for some time the unwanted step-child for the developers to parade around as an asset and selling point when convenient only to be locked away and isolated in a different part of the house afterwards when inconvenient. There was a time the devs actually treated the community as an adult engaging and interacting with the community on a regular basis very much like Yoshi-P does with regards to FFXIV. Unfortunately, a wall was erected at sometime early 2012 that they have reversed their tact and their interaction has been more akin to GhostCrawler(WoW) and his treatment of their community since. The former is what drew me to Illyriad and the hope that this interaction will be restored kept me involved with the game up till the end of 2013. The latter is the underlying reason of why I refuse to stick around any longer - my vote of no confidence in the dev team. In 2013, the devs pretty much ignored the community giving their attention to their favored sibling AoA. When they did engage the Illyriad community they did worse then ignore us they turned their back and walked away mid dialogue. “What additional data after the tournament should be released” is still unresolved - this is not the first time additional data for various tournaments has been discussed only to have the devs walk away. Another still unresolved dialogue is what should be done with the numerous one square currently unusable lakes/lochs/etc scattered about the map, And of course the appropriately named Broken Lands so hyped in the beginning of the year to be subsequently ignored only to have a carrot on a stick dangled in front of the community in the form of an incomplete map. A map that they had rendered in a viewable 3D form for almost 8 months prior to its 2D rollout. There are a large number of unresolved issues dealing with bug resolution(or lack thereof), multi-accounting, perma-sat accounts, etc... that any number of veteran players can attest to. For me, the deciding factor in my leaving Illyriad (though truly RL was the biggest factor) is this diametrically opposed treatment of the community. If we “The community” is as big an asset as you “The Devs” parade it around to be - then I hope you will return to treating it as an adult in the immediate future. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/26125" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: Sir Bradly
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 00:18
Well said... ------------- [04:46]<HATHALDIR> okay,I'm a bully |
Posted By: Lwyllyn
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 00:46
|
Edited: Stop posting private interactions between you and the developers. This is yet another warning. The problem is that you are posting things out of context and only continuing to push an issue that is not really an issue. Any further issues can result in the suspension of your forum access.
GM Rikoo |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 01:07
|
I agree with a lot of what Anjire said. I think it's possible that part of the problem is growing pains of Illyriad Ltd. as the operation becomes more complex. It seems like the choice has been to create a layer of bureaucracy to "protect" the developers from the burden of dealing with players. From the point of view of a busy CEO, this makes sense. However, sometimes it doesn't seem that the manner in which this has been implemented is consistent with the spirit in which Stormcrow and ThunderCat have interacted with the community in the past. Having a community manager (focusing on that part of the role alone) can have a number of goals such as 1) engaging the community and providing more hands-on attention than a busy administrator and/or coder can do and 2) freeing up the top executives to focus on the roles that return the most value for the company (and the players). These are really good goals, and things that likely need to happen. And to some degree, they are happening now. The question is, is this being done as effectively as possible? And if not, how can it be more effective? I am sure that Stormcrow, Rikoo and others ask themselves these questions daily. I would hope that Illyriad players are seen as a resource and not a barrier, a source of solutions rather than a source of problems to be solved, as the Illyriad team moves forward. We really do want to help.
|
Posted By: Lwyllyn
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 01:34
|
GM Rikoo- the entire issue at hand is about communications between GMs and players. So what are you saying? It's not as if I am trying to start an uprising against you, I am merely telling illy that everything you do has GM Stormcrow's full support. Whether we like it or not. Love it or leave it. Why was my first post deleted? And why were my IGMs ignored? <--- honest question seeks honest answer. My entire alliance is a bit up in arms over this. I have been trying to talk an alliance mate out of quitting, prognosis not good. Another alliance mate clicked 'abandon' today- We were too late for him. And folks are attempting to talk me out of quitting, prognosis also not good. Remember when we used to try to talk our friends into joining illyriad? |
Posted By: Angrim
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 01:43
|
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 02:09
I agree but I also believe the flip side which is that it's also essential that the company have the full support of the player community, specifically the vets, rather than relying on fresh meat to keep them afloat. There is also that old saying about power and corruption. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: abstractdream
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 02:46
|
As a player of Illyriad, I want to add my two cents worth to this discussion. There have always been (as far I have seen, for 2 & 1/2 years now) players with complaints and gripes about the "unfairness" of the rules or the way those rules have been applied to themselves specifically or someone they know. I think it's safe to say that is just the way it is and ever will be. The majority of us just ignore that and play as usual. I can't really attest to the way GC is now because I rarely venture into it, but in the past I saw morons, smart ass know-it-alls, kids acting like kids and apparent adults acting like kids, players who had nothing better to do than antagonize everyone around them and the occasional entertainers. It was a hodgepodge of people and honestly, rarely held my attention for more than a few minutes. Now, whenever I venture into GC it's to say hi to players I know and thats about it. I truly don't find anything of value about it and would likely not notice if it were discontinued. The community manager can ban whoever he wants from GC and I wont notice. He can delete whatever forum posts he pleases and I wont care. I believe that is the majority view. I could be wrong but I doubt it. Now, as for the Dev-player relationship, I have been as patient as anyone, I suppose however it is becoming glaringly obvious that TBL is way over due, there hasn't been any sort of major release at all for well over a year and there hasn't been a tournament in months and months and months. There have been new players come and go for some time now and nothing new has come online since the release of Trade 2.0. We have been teased for years about so many great things and I do understand the problems that are popping up to keep them away but it is frustrating. Pathfinding, Battle Magik (which, I can only assume many of the useless crafting materials are meant for) and an improved chat/IGM system are a few of the things I would like to see but it seems less and less likely that they will ever happen. I guess the biggest mistake the Devs made was revealing things before they were ready. It was interesting but now it's just sad. Having said all that, Illyriad is a free, browser based game, with so much depth that it has held my attention five times longer than World of Warcraft did, the game I played longer than any other before Illy. What the Devs have created is a wonder of online games. It has allowed myself and others of a similar mindset to get together and become as close as online gamers could ever be. I call us a family. While that could be seen as absurd by outsiders, it is as near the truth as digitally allowable. If Illy never has another update and stays exactly as it is now, it will be enough. ------------- |
Posted By: Brandmeister
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 02:53
|
Under normal conditions, I think it's possible to have a sensible disagreement between developers and customers without resorting to either player invective or GM censorship. However, it is undeniable that players have grown heated in their opinions over time, as major gameplay problems dragged on. Cities were destroyed via the exodus bug, armies misplaced, sov issues remained tangled, and other problems were encountered with no apparent response. Patient discourse requires trust. After a certain amount of time, players will resort to invective, and GMs will be forced to censorship. When players have invested real money via prestige, their threshold for impatience falls rapidly (and it should). For the record, the community manager rarely deserves the heat. But they are the front line of customer service, and that does tend to make them a lightning rod for discontent. |
Posted By: Malek
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 04:40
AS the first line of defense for the Devs, being hired for the particular skill in managing a community, it is a given that a pre-requisite skill for the position is the effective management of people, hence the term Manager. Respect in any situation needs to be earnt and can never be commanded. Censoring people for disagreeing with you or arguing with you is exceptionally adolescent like behaviour. One thing that has been showcased is the influx of newbies, this would have more to do with the demise of LoU rather than any effective marketing campaign and I am not sure how long those new players are hanging around. One thing that needs to be made clear, you may just call us "Gamers" the reality of it is that the majority of people in this game are not only mature aged, a lot of them are also professionals (i.e accountants, engineers, doctors etc), we enjoy playing this game immensely, we have the disposable income to throw around on frivolous things like games which also means we can also throw it at something else. Which personally I have already done, the money that I could have spent on prestige went to Star Citizen and that game is not even finished yet. That points out another issue, no one cares that broken lands is not out. I have said this before, keeping us informed on your progress, what has happened, any issues that you have encountered in coding or bugs is what people like to see. This is a digitial product we cant see it being built like a traditional house or building, in lieu of that, we need to be able to see what is being done could be pictures or simulated movements on youtube to watch, anything like that we dont care just FEED us. You want the invective against GM's to stop? You want players to play nice? You want everything to be hunky dory? Then you have to work at it, it is what we pay you for in the purchasing of prestige, we are bored, we are frustrated. You should be very proud of the fact that there is a very loyal customer base here that has stuck around playing this game, though the number of those loyal customers still here is starting to decline. As Anjire stated the community is put on show when it needs to be for game reviews and such, what happens if we are not around? You have the release of Broken Lands coming out eventually and you will be using its release to target a whole new lot of players, I hope you have a business plan for the release of BL, if you dont get one, if you do, you will need the current player base to assist the new people playing the game, in how it all comes together and what not as the Devs wont be around to introduce them to the game like they did when it started. If nobody wants to help the new players in BL, then player retention will be non existent there. It is always cheaper to retain a customer than it is to attract a new one.
|
Posted By: Lwyllyn
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 05:27
|
I agree that the players who are active in GC are the minority. Most players log in, work their build and production queues, dispatch gatherers, and log out. Those players almost never come into contact with a DEV, even one who is on as often as GM Rikoo. And some almost never even come into contact with other players. This discussion isn't really for those players. It's the same as those talks about who is razing too many of their enemy's cities. It affects those who have a direct interest in the matter, and the rest don't care. Some players are in chat every time you log in. Some are liked, some are loved, and some are despised. This is the community that is affected by negative player-developer relations. These are the folks who do care. If you love your alliance, but it is being torn apart from within, then your AC would not be having uplifting convos. Fortunately, the Fellowship is a close family with a harmonious AC. But the community in GC is like my second alliance, and i am seeing a decline in participation. Partly from vets leaving, from disgusted players turning GC off, and partly because folks are afraid that their normal banter will get them banned. The outpouring of support I have gotten in this matter- both from my alliance and from my friends in GC has blown my mind. It also proves (at least, to me) that there is hope for our community. We are not perfect. My role in this issue isn't perfect. I made a valid point in GC to GM Rikoo, concerning his interpretation of the CoC. What caused him to silence me was... well, admittedly, I could have worded it better. More to the point, I probably could not have worded it worse. But why censor for a week when a 'Hey, Lwyllyn, don't be an ass!' would suffice? We all need that reminder once in a while, don't we? That said- the fact that this thread has more participants than just me and GM Rikoo seems to show that there is an underlying issue, and not just one isolated incident with one lone player. And for one lone player of 18 months in GC so far, the thought of clicking 'abandon' is akin to moving 8000 miles from your family and friends and throwing your phone in the ocean. Not a decision all of us can take lightly. GM Rikoo: while my opinion of how GC has been handled recently has not changed, I do recognize that my comment in GC was out of line, and my handling of the matter through IGMs, the petition, and my more hostile forum posts was all wrong. I once mildly opined to you that you should relax. I failed to take my own advice here, and made a mess. ...And now to really surprise everyone: GM Rikoo, my actions to this point have been out of line. Please accept my sincere apology, and my promise to let you do your job in peace. And please get something positive out of this; I did. |
Posted By: Myll
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 06:19
|
I applaud the move Lwyllyn made in her apology. My two cents on the community as a whole: we are getting many new players, and this trend will continue on through the month of May when Lords of Ultima (LoU) shuts down, regardless other marketing efforts. We need to embrace the new players and welcome them in - many are experienced gamers and will be great for the game. I have said this many times: the first 24-48 hours are critical to Retention of new players. GM Rikoo: Illyriad needs folks like you. Your motivation to hold events is a breath of fresh air and you will always have both strong points and weaker points. Your strong point is definitely in pushing these new events to create something new and keep things lively. With increased numbers in this game, maybe one day we can get a 2nd community manager/assistant to help balance your workload. One thing all of us need to remember is that the game company behind Illyriad is still maturing (much as Rill said earlier), but that doesn't mean they have the ability to go hire lots of folks to manage individual issues (yet). They're all multi-tasking, as we see, although some in our community complain more than others as to what tasks in that list should be prioritized more than others. Critical changes needed: At the top of the list should be work toward new chat rooms; the game needs additional chat rooms beyond Global Chat (GC). Player Retention should be considered - a new default GC that allows any player to enter, even one who just registered and may be initially plodding along with the tutorial, should stay the default. However, we need other "Trade" and/or "Diplomacy" rooms also where sidebars can go to leave GC for a more detailed conversation along those lines. Having new players in my alliance, I hear lots of fresh ideas, and some players are surprised especially at no Trade Channel for those who would rather have a Social process to Trading things in the game. And consider - you must have a Trader to be capable of buying and selling the more recently added resources: minerals, herbs, and anatomies, and resultant crafted items. A new player short of a Trader has no other option but to be social and attempt to sell in a Global Chat, as consideration. Myll
|
Posted By: Coltaine Blackwing
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 07:07
|
As someone who frequently shuts off GC entirely, I have to say that I don't care about much of what Malek has said. My reason is not invective against the GMs. The people who frequent GC can claim to be mature adults all they like. Maybe they are outside the game, but what I see these days more and more is what abstractdream said. People can blame the GMs, but everyone is responsible for their own behavior and the level of vitriol in GC is appalling. Rikoo has become a target since he showed up, and he did nothing to deserve it. It's just all degenerated since then, but the point is this: the players struck first. It's not just directed at the GMs, either. Between the wars, personal attacks and people intentionally bringing up real life topics they know are controversial and forbidden, GC is almost constantly setting a poor example to new players and alienating vets. I'm disgusted by the fact that they now complain about being silenced for repeatedly bringing negativity into GC without offering anything else to justify their presence on chat. Anything else a person may do in the game with an alliance or friends is irrelevant when speaking to the community as a whole. The real truth is that the attitudes of the players have driven more people from GC and Illy than anything the GMs could possibly do. There are plenty of other venues for you to make your voices heard that won't drag down the community even further. I don't much care if other people are happy with the game or not at this point. Just keep it off GC. You've done more than enough damage as it is.
|
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 08:12
Excuse me, but when one of your employees received complains from your clients, you have to address the complaints AND back up the employee at the same time ... Doing either one and ignoring the other obligation is tipping the boat towards unbalanced situations where the employee loses all authority, as you said, or the clients lose all their willingness to keep doing business with your company. The way I see it, if this situation keeps up we are soon going to see alliances mass-abandon ... if that is what the DEVs want, then hey, fine by me, but I think that it is our obligation to point out that things are going downhill ...
How many people stayed from that huge influx of players from that google ad, last year .?. LoU players will not stick around to a game that is so obviously tipping on its heels, especially after they just got kicked out of another game they played for years ...
I have a different opinion ... we are either a community or we are just a jumble of random people playing the same game ... in that regard, I didn't have any much of a personal interaction with most people that got whacked with the banhammer, but I still find the way they got that treatment aggravating ... if we ignore the issue just because it is not banging on our doors, then we shouldn't complain that the DEVs ignore the community, because we will be ignoring it as well ...
Of course you can ... you cannot imagine what different kinds of hell I have raised in the official League of Legends fora, in both European servers ... do they ban my accounts or erase my posts .?. No ! They even sent me a rare Teemo statue for my contribution
+100000
It is not only that ... I have had no problem with GMs so far and I didn't mind the lack of updates nor bugs ... I didn't even complain about them even when I was personally inconvenienced by shadow blockades and stuff like that ... You do not need a prior problem to spot a current one ... and at the moment this sudden "hey it is in the rules, here is a ban" mentality is ruining the gaming mentality and the fun of the game ... if we are going to watch whatever we say as if the GMs are like a weird school principal that is just looking for an excuse to expel you from school, then where is the fun in that .?. And especially when your own promised and words (see all the unfinished stuff and projects) are already dust in the wind, deciding one day that you should hold your clients accountable for every little thing they say, is to say the least bad marketing.
Why .?. I already feel bad for advertising the game in other game's forum and parading Illyriad around a good game to play with a nice community ... as the situation stands though, how could I, in good conscience, make people stay in a game that I wouldn't in good faith propose to others .?.
True ... but did the players that do/dis that get the banhammer .?. Nope ... it was mostly people that try to put a lid on things ... which explains the complaints on the matter ... ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: Twist
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 09:47
|
after more than 2 years in Illyriad, yesteday I was honoured by me first chat ban.... the offence? to question in GC the impartiality of a GM when handling a complaint petition that was complaining about that same GM... no offensive, foul or abusive language was used.... only questioning the impartiality... it seems that GM's deem themselves the Gods of Illy, and are above criticism, if you dare, be prepared to be silenced |
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 10:53
I highly doubt that such a thing even needs questioning ... the answer is blatantly obvious, especially since the only person known to have managed that got his name written in history, just for that super rare occasion (*) ... As for the DEVs thinking that they are above criticism, I am thinking that any game is nothing without its playerbase ... though it does seem to me that we are wasting our time here and the DEVs are set on their course of emptying the game of veterans (I still cannot find what they hope to gain out of that though ) ... Edit: (*) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristides ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2014 at 15:20
It's possible to be a God and still be kind, understanding, forgiving and benevolent. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: Evae
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 07:51
|
You Banned Twist??? Really? |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 08:59
I had a recent disagreement with a GM in GC, I had quite the opposite response from said GM. He didn't close the argument down instead tried to reason with me, even thought I was right :p I have a lot more respect for him now. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Coltaine Blackwing
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 09:22
|
I find it depressing that Twist is aggressively complaining about getting silenced for complaining about something that someone else apologized for...thereby admitting that they did something wrong to begin with. This sort of thoughtlessness is why people are leaving. And then they have the gall to blame it on someone else. I'd rather have an empty game than one full of people shedding their maturity like it's gone out of fashion. Learn from your alliancemate, please.
|
Posted By: Twist
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 10:06
|
"aggressively complaining? could you give an example of said aggression? I really would like to avoid being agressive in the future and would appreciate your help in this.... as for the complaining bit..... I was questioning the impartiality and complaints process itself, when a petition is handled by the very person the petition is complaining about (I apologise if I have been aggressive in this post also, as I said, I would appreciate your guidance and help so I can be more docile, more.... compliant rather than complaining ;)
|
Posted By: Lwyllyn
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 10:52
|
Really, Coltaine? SirTwist's style of complaining is why people are leaving? Really? SirTwist is likely the least aggressive member of our community! And yes, I went about much of this the wrong way. But the incident that set this off was just one of several. Those of us who consider the folks in GC to be family take a chat ban seriously. Maybe, unlike some of us, you have a social life outside of Illy. Maybe you don't live 10 miles from your closest neighbor, and only need to sit on your doorstep to talk to your friends. Maybe you are a loner who doesn't need friends. Maybe you can just shut off GC without a second thought. Maybe you haven't a clue why this thread exists. Most of the forum members who have posted on this thread have had issues with how GC is being handled. Most posts are in support of one perspective or another. And many of the posters were there when this started. And most have something to add, rather than merely trolling someone's opinion. Except you. You haven't had a run-in with GM Rikoo, you weren't there, and not one word of your two posts was constructive. This is a discussion (or debate, or argument, whatever) about the GC community. You seem to have no desire to be a part of that community, so why are you posting flame attacks in this thread? Just the same way you can shut off chat because you don't like what folks say there, you can choose not to follow this thread. Omigod, did I just have to explain the obvious, again?  |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 13:14
|
Lwyllyn, Is Coltaine not allowed to state an opinion? ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 13:27
Every opinion is obviously allowed ... but don't you think that an opinion that shoves the yearly-long wave of players leaving the game on to a particular player's mode of behavior is a bit over the top .?. Also, using epithets on people without "backing them up" goes a bit beyond the "hey that is my opinion" and an elaboration should be in order to avoid misunderstandings.  Last, but not least, getting annoyed from people that complain when they feel that they had been wronged is quite a feat ... aren't they entitled to their opinions .?. ------------- Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 14:03
|
I agree deranzin, obviously Sir Twist's behaviour was not the reason ppl left, I doubt one person left becasue of it. I do not agree that Coltaine's comments are flaming though, that in my opinion is a slight exaggeration, and regardless of involvement in the situation we are all allowed an opinion on this subject. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: GM Rikoo
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2014 at 14:36
|
Closing the thread. Obviously I can't ask you all to stop discussing things that happen between a player and a GM, because it won't happen. It leads to the phone game which only leads to more people thinking they know what happened, when in fact that did not. In the future, I'll have to keep this in mind. For the record, Twist and anyone else who has been silenced survived the procedure. I can assure you that they did not, indeed, die horribly. GM Rikoo ------------- Illyriad Community Manager / Public Relations / community@illyriad.co.uk |