If you don't want to fight, leave VICX and join TACO or another of many non-warring alliances.

As nobody can force you to stay ... likewise no body/ no thought can force you to leave..

You are a sore loser, and that was a terrible attempt to create anger towards H?

You will be missed.

Sorry to see you go regardless.

What the others said Afaslizo is correct ... what exactly would really be your problem in finding a peaceful alliance .?. I propose you stay in the game and join Tranquil Vision or any other peace-dedicated alliance ... they are really nice people and need friendly and experienced players like you. :)

Or a trading alliance ... or a training alliance ... or or or ... so many options, so many peaceful things to do ! :)

If this person is leaving as a result of having all their progress shattered to pieces, then they obviously have cause to be bitter. If you can honestly objectively look at it; both sides believe they are fighting on the right side and for any to feel like it is necessary to leave as a consequence of losing everything, it should be handled with a bit of empathy and sensitivity. It should be the duty of Illyriad's community to make sure that this departing isn't an excuse to kick someone while they're down.

Even enemies can show respect.

Congratulations to those who actually managed to say goodbye like a decent person.

Also being politically correct and always care and be sensitive is bullsh*t.

And that's just the thing. Southern Dwarf didn't actually make any cheap shots - he said there were H? players

Southern Dwarf wrote: who just wish to turn Illy in said wargame.

really? 

i find those that always has to tell people how sorry they are for them is the sociopathic ones. we all know that people dont really care for anyone not close by them in relation :/ 

No. Because crying my eyes out does nothing; nor do I have the power to change world infrastructure to ensure equal food distribution.

By typing that out I can at least attempt to make a few people I will probably never meet in my life understand that across the internets behind a screen sits another person, and it behoves us to understand that it's the innumerable small acts of kindness that keep us living through hardships like hunger. World issues are things that can only be addressed united as a species, whereas these things are very much our own issues that only reflect on our individual selves.

Kumomoto wrote: It's a two way street. How about "I'm sorry I joined an aggressive coalition and didn't leave the alliance when it went to war (and wouldn't have been touched), but decided to stay and fight, even though I'm a pacifist, but now that we are clearly losing, I am quitting and blaming the folks I fought against for having war when I belonged to a warlike coalition in the first place". But that might have looked (rightly) a bit hypocritical.

Perhaps from your viewpoint. But from an isolationist's view, this mess has gotten so convoluted no outsider can tell what the hell is going on and who attacked who first, and I can say it's best to view each person as their own individual instead of one blobby mass of alliance. In any case Southern Dwarf said nothing of any blame beyond saying ". . . H?" are turning Illyriad into nothing more than a war game.

I'm not even going into the specifics of whether or not Southern Dwarf had any role in deciding his alliance's policies or its decision in joining Consone, nor if he joined just to have war and die, mainly because I have no idea about that. But honestly, even if he did and this is all somehow his doing, it would be the difference between shaking hands with someone you've just won a long game of chess with and flipping the table over at his face because he blamed you for checkmating him.

it is just as wrong to say that illy is only war as it is to try to take war out of it.  illyriad without the potential for war would be like poker without wagering.  it is the threat of war that makes players accountable for their actions.  if war were to become impossible, there would be no value to peace.

this thread presents a false dilemma between two games, neither of which is illy.

And I don't see anything in the OP begrudging his conquerors for defeating him at war. Only that he cannot play in something he believes "is just a war game."

And thereupon lies my gripe about why it's suddenly ok to begin insulting a defeated foe you'll never have to deal with again, because he supposedly stated a correct opinion held by H? & co. players.

Angrim wrote: Southern Dwarf wrote: who just wish to turn Illy in said wargame. It is just as wrong to say that illy is only war as it is to try to take war out of it.

+1

For the record, Southern Dwarf is a decent bloke whose main joy in Illy was trying to decipher its mysteries and mechanics.  He also valued the friendship of his allies which is why he did not leave the alliance.

He was not an aggressive player, and indeed did not have two spears to rub together.  Due to the constant attacks on his defenceless towns, he felt unable to pursue his interests in Illy, and as he did not want to leave his mates either he chose to leave the game.

Just because this is the latest post on this thread, I do not claim the "final word", so don't feel as if you have to dissect my words through piecemeal quotes - but I do ask that we cease posting to this thread, it's done now - he's gone, and we've all had our say.

Ehm ... not to spoil this for anyone, but an IGM to the leadership of both sides saying that he will not participate in the war since he doesn't like it and doesn't have any army either way would have rendered him almost perfectly safe even within a warring alliance.

There are so many solutions for his complaint that it is mindboggling that he left the game because of it.

Bye Afaslizo.

I honestly have nothing left to say that has already been said.

Since apparently morality doesn't exist anymore, have some forum rules.

Code of Conduct

In order to create a positive and respectful environment for both the Illyriad players and staff, the following are strictly pr http://www.illyriad.co.uk/terms-and-conditions" rel="nofollow - ohibited both in game and on the forums:

It sounds to me like Consone betrayed Alfas by failing to defend him.

Southern Dwarf wrote: I just thought I would have found a game which just not would turn into a 08/15 wargame. I was wrong obviously and will now leave. If my alliance is unable to take my account over I offer it to anyone interested in magic and mysteries and totally unrelated to the . . . in H? who just wish to turn Illy in said wargame.  Goodbye Ily. So much wasted potential.

This sounds like someone who feels betrayed by their own alliance to you? This sounds like a pacifist who wasn't ready for the consequences to you? The very fact that getting out of the war is apparently as easy as declaring to both sides you're staying out of the conflict is enough to know that it's probably best to not go on, and on, and on, and on and on in a farewell thread about something that Alfas made no allusions towards.

The attempts to discredit the oppositions instead of hearing out what they have to say are getting rather worn out and overused. If you're going to use lies as excuses to insult someone you really shouldn't then go on to do the exact same thing you're blaming strawmen for.

Kumomoto wrote: ...Taking a parting cheap shot at your enemy for actions that he or she chose that have consequences, just because he/she is losing has an amazingly diminutive effect on the sympathy factor...

I suppose Kumomoto is right, taking parting cheap shots at your enemy for actions they chose has a rather good knack for diminishing sympathy.

You are at war. Whoever leaves as a result of getting razed out of the game has only to blame those who sieged them to begin with - and this is a consequence of war that has to be accepted, not excused. You cannot claim any moral high ground (it's clearly not a good thing), nor have to excuse it to begin with (after all they WERE your enemy). Which begs the question why you feel the need to pretend them getting razed by you is some grave misdemeanor that excuses you insulting and disrespecting people like this - to say you're against bullying when you do so yourselves, is just plain wrong.

I have seen people on these post nothing but rhetoric again and again, insult every perceived slight from legitimate statements and even people actively trying to get others in Illy to leave. It is rather worrying to see the moral guardians of Illyriad apparently abandon all sense of their morality.

No one has been sieged out of Illy.  That requires all towns to be razed and then recurring attacks on the New Settlement respawn.  That has not occurred in this war to any player.

Cry babies have threatened to quit.  I say "Quit then."

Cry babies have quit and had little tantrums on their way out.  I say "Good Riddance."

Consone started this war.  Win, Surrender, or die are the only 3 ways it will end.  Consone ain't winning.  Consone ain't surrendering.  And several members of Consone have chosen to quit Illy rather than join their brethren in a fight to the death.   That is their choice.

Here is how Consone has behaved in this war:

Personal Insults from Leadership against me in mails, GC, and the forums.  I have had to submit many petitions.  It appears that players are now being suspended for personal abuse.

Several Consone have mailed me threatening RL suicide of one of their members unless RES quits the war.  One even said "paramedics have been called."

Now Consone is down to the metagame tactic of players quitting Illy because Consone is losing so somehow this is "destroying Illy."

Consone should not have started a war that it can not bear to lose.

The_Dude wrote: Consone started this war.  Win, Surrender, or die are the only 3 ways it will end.  Consone ain't winning.  Consone ain't surrendering.  And several members of Consone have chosen to quit Illy rather than join their brethren in a fight to the death.   That is their choice.

Then if you want that stop making comments about how Consone don't want peace. I wouldn't speak for them and I dare say the people they're fighting would make better spokespersons.

Be sincere about your dealings as you are now.

The_Dude wrote: Personal Insults from Leadership against me in mails, GC, and the forums.  I have had to submit many petitions.  It appears that players are now being suspended for personal abuse.

Be that as it may I have only ever seen people from the coalition's side deal out the insults on the forums. This thread alone is testament to that. Someone also happens to be pressuring people into quitting. You wouldn't know who that is would you?

The_Dude wrote: Several Consone have mailed me threatening RL suicide of one of their members unless RES quits the war.  One even said "paramedics have been called."

And this is what I mean. There is no way to verify if this is true or not and in any case this is something incredibly sensitive if it were true. Something I would have never brought up here and immediately sorted out with the persons involved and them alone, instead of showboating it in the forums for some sick publicity stunt.

And we're back to the strawmen.

I swear this is honestly beyond horrible. The whole issue here is that you feel it's ok to insult and harass Consone players because they're... Losing?
You're bullying for what?

GM Luna