So who's winning and is it really Illy armageddon?
Printed From: Illyriad
Category: The World
Forum Name: Politics & Diplomacy
Forum Description: If you run an alliance on Elgea, here's where you should make your intentions public.
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=4472
Printed Date: 17 Apr 2022 at 04:19
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: So who's winning and is it really Illy armageddon?
Posted By: Silverlake
Subject: So who's winning and is it really Illy armageddon?
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 01:35
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So who thinks they are winning? Is winning possible? Are the undeclared affected? Was it really the armageddon some predicted? Let's chat! ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57338" rel="nofollow"> 
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Replies:
Posted By: Silverlake
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 02:00
P.S. I was asking everyone but Rill/Rydell,  , no offense in the biblical sense...------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57338" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Myr
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 02:10
| Definitely NOT Armageddon. |
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 02:57
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It is the loss of a large portion of all military units in-game. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 03:51
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I am winning! MWHAHAHAHA! I am the most evilest in all of Illy! MWHAHAHAHA!  Please allow me to introduce myself....
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Posted By: Kumomoto
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 03:56
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It is Armageddon! Run for the hills! It's the end of Illy! Let's write a blog about it! Kumo grabs his fluffy slippers and his love fern and runs to his underground shelter... |
Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 04:02
| I think you guys have stated in GC that you are winning, which is probably right if you base it on cities razed which seems to be the accepted method. Kudos to the "coalition"(that is official now isn't it?) |
Posted By: Aurordan
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 04:45
| Interesting. So we can start discussion threads deliberately excluding a player, and any post they make will be deleted? Not sure how I feel about that. |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 05:17
If the coalition grew by two cities losing three would be a loss, and if consone grew by 30 cities losing 25 might be not too bad. Both sides have cities they can't defend in 2013, and losing them now could be a good riddance. Without crowlition and DSD it can't be an Illy armageddon.
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Mr Damage wrote:Posted By: Aurordan
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 05:29
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Actually, Darkstar is in. We just need Crows. And a few significant independents. And for Illy to end, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
EDIT: Upon further reflection, I realize I have more to say. I agree that Consone still has the capacity to make a fight of it, but I think it will depend on whether they can pull together and keep their members on the field or if desertion and disinterest take too high a toll. Thus far it seems they've been far more susceptible to that than their opponents.
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Posted By: Darmon
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 07:32
I thought only The Colony had declared war? And even then, that it was only on one Consone alliance? I figured TCol was just pursuing their own agenda, since they only declared on Worlds End (same as RES and Curse). I wish someone would tell me why everyone seems to hate WE. Though, if anyone would like to correct me, please do. It's been a while since much news has surfaced about the war (though I'd sort of prefer it if we didn't grow another 60-some page mega thread in here).
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Posted By: Bonaparta
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 08:17
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Who is winning the war? Since BSH is neutral my only source of information are Elgea stats and trade activity. From outside perspective it looks something like that: Trade activity is slowly slowing down and prices are returning to pre-tourney pre-war state. The impact of the tourney on trade was far greater than war, so I'm guessing that casualty rate in the war is also much lower than in tourney. Some semi-large battles are happening all the time, but from graph of all moving attacking and defending armies I can conclude that commutative casualties are also way lower than in the tourney. Since 33% of the server is involved in the war I thought this would be higher. Well obviously "blietzkrieg" didn't happen. Partly because of new siege rules that makes fast razing (less than a day) very hard next to impossible and training time disadvantage of defensive units against offensive ones. At the beginning some Absa towns were razed, but that actually makes less than 1% of Consone population. From strategic point of view this is negligible. Psychological impact might be higher. I think that the war has reached kind of a stalemate where neither side is launching numerous well defended sieges and other side is able to brake those sieges. Projection: H? & Co had advantage at the beginning of the war with larger army sizes. Initial army size is less important each day that the war continues, so the final winner will be determined by the army production rate. Who has higher army production rate is hard to determine, but if I had to guess I would say Consone, simply because of more towns. Town size is really not a big factor in production rates. How many inactives there are in each camp is hard to determines, but I would guess about the same. I've saw no simultaneous 100 town sieges so far from any side which would in my opinion if successful be decisive strategical move. So I conclude that strategy from both camps is about the same- limited sieges to isolated targets. How well this tactic is implemented, well from the number of razed towns I would say it is not very effective. Both camps have more population than in the beginning of the war, so raze rate is very low indeed. My betting odds today would be 60:40 in favour of H? + others, but if war continues without any large scale siege operations for another week, I would say around 50:50. Of course this prognosis would be different if anyone else joined this war, especially Crows. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/95216" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 09:26
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Posted By: Darmon
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 09:39
Yeah, I thought about asking if Night Confed is what he meant, but they're also only just sorta in the war. More like, they take issue with those 3 particular alliances, and the rest just happen to be confederates. Question still stands about WE, though I guess it would also be nice to know why Absa and Roads are tied for a close second on the hate-o-meter. I guess that might get into what this war is really about, since I think most people agree that it's not Trove. And no one has been very forthcoming about that.
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Posted By: R88
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 11:01
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OK my opinion on the war is as follows; Harmless have the numbers and the troops strength but have no target. No target because for an alliance to effectively assault another alliance you need to take out there leaders, and because consone has "no Leader" Harmless has no target. This is why they are only attacking isolated towns and players consone also have the number but they cant co-ordinate there attack, so no head way has been made. Right now it a stalemate as mentioned by bonaparta and this is because harmless has no target and consone cant act as one(no offense to anyone) as for effecting other people if you are not involved in the war there has really been no effect on you. now for the, "is this armageddon"? well i don't think so it all seems like a whole lot of barking and no biting and no harmless only slapped consone they never bit them!  this is my opinion looking forward to hear what the rest of illy thinks R88
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Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 11:11
 There's another personal reason why WES at war with *SKR* would be odd; besides both alliances are rather small (#70 and #71 on page 4), and don't matter. If the wars reach a point where other factors are more important, well, 
Updated to fix the censored icon without annotation.
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Posted By: twilights
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 12:51
| its hard to fight a war when u are an attack dog and u have been muzzled....but i am learning alot and the game mechanics are excellent....oh by the way there is a vast difference between peace time economy and war time economy....also the war hasnt been going so long yet....kindof reminds me of the pacific war during war world 2, island hopping, lots of logistics and planning....excellent war game |
Posted By: Grego
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 13:11
| You mean War in the Pacific? That was a great strategy game :) |
Posted By: Mogul
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 13:43
The real war did started and majority of units are already dead... I think to regain pre-tournament strength both sides would need at least 6 months. There are many towns that lost 25k T2 cavalry or 30k T2 ranged units. I have war related combat reports from almost 1000 fights (962) and there where much more. Not everyone from Consone did send them to me and also because of many partial combat reports we received. So to have full war casualties both sides would need to provide all their combat reports. But from those I have collected I can tell that more than 5 million units together where already killed and on XP casualties it looks like this: Consone XP casualties: 6 828 108 H? & Co. XP casualties: 7 836 694 Of course I have that detailed for every involved alliance, player or town but I am not going to post those tables here. Just this summary table from one side: http://i48.tinypic.com/1zqzw34.png" rel="nofollow - http://i48.tinypic.com/1zqzw34.png And my guess is I have around 2/3 of data so this might be 66% Concerning towns I wanted to make some difference comparison with current state against state before war but I found only xml datafile from 22nd September and there are bigger effects than war on number of towns. Results for Consone I got are like this New towns: 371 Lost towns: 296 Joined towns: 251 Left towns: 592 Relocated towns: 85 So 22nd September there where 296 towns part of Consone which are no more existing in Illyriad, mostly from abandoned accounts and in that number are also those razed in war. A lot of towns that are "left" where from ~FF~ alliance which was part of Consone but now is empty (I don't have any details on that). Btw I am looking for file datafile_towns.xml from 12th October or around that date. :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Some interesting units killed in this war include also Praetorian Guardsmen : 692 Elite Praetorian Guardsmen : 289 Scrawny Wolves : 29 Pure Fire Elementals : 3 Pure Water Elementals : 2 Pure Earth Elementals : 2 and more then 1100 siege units killed  |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 15:25
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Posted By: kerozen
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 15:31
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I would love to add the casualties to my war graph :) ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/194801" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Ander
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 16:39
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H wants to continue with the war, so I deduce they have some aims which they want to complete. If their aims are being met, then H is winning the war. If not, H is probably loosing. Consone is not keen to fight anyone. So 'win' for consone is to come out from the war without loosing strength.
Absa haven't had any unfriendly contacts with NC or NA before. World's End have no cities in Mal Motsha or Keshalia where TCol is located. DARK is based in the western realms and VICX is based in Larn. The attacks look more like a splitting of targets rather than based on hatred or landgrab. Either ~N and DARK* have shared interests with H, or they are in it to gain a powerful ally. Probably just the latter. |
Posted By: jordigui
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 18:05
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Great stats! Thanks Mogul! Could be possible to know the value of these casualties in xp? In order to discriminate a bit between spears and cavalry. Thanks But from those I have collected I can tell that more than 5 million units together where already killed and on XP casualties it looks like this: Consone XP casualties: 6 828 108 H? & Co. XP casualties: 7 836 694 |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 18:11
Your second sentence makes a lot more sense than your first. ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: Le Roux
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 18:48
Baffled by the analogy ... amused by the funky ô , and have no desire to be a WWI US , last I checked while I may live in Arizona, I am still very Québécois !  ------------- 
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Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 19:11
Would you let up already? It's one thing to take a shot at someone and another to troll them, every chance you possibly can. -------------  |
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 19:17
Have you seen the crap from the other side in GC? Talk about bringing it on herself. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 19:37
This has been going on long before any of this war stuff came up. Silverlake has taken every chance he can to take a shot at Rill. Even in threads where it was completely off topic. It's uncalled for and I'm sick of seeing it. If you don't like someone then grow up and just ignore them. There are only a few players I dislike in illy but you still don't see me making forum posts about them. ------------- |
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 19:51
Everything just said can be applied in the other direction too - I don't see you taking action that way though. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 19:58
I've yet to see Rill troll a harmless member but if you can prove otherwise then it's another story. Though I don't think fighting fire with fire is a particularly mature (or effective for that matter) way of dealing with it. I have seen her involve herself in a situation she's not involved in, if that's what your talking about, but Silverlake's post only made that worse, because he involved her in something she herself hadn't even involved herself in. As I said, not particularly effective. ------------- |
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 21:03
You missed the rant in which she referred to my city as the heart of corruption then? I've lost count of the number of times I've looked in GC to see "H? this" and "H? That" and Rill being the culprit. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 21:09
Players building 12 units per hour can cover daily losses of 288 units. If they lost 20,160 units in the tournament before the war it takes them 70 days (Oct 1 to Dec 9) to replace these troops.
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Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 21:27
Except that they've been spending troops at a high rate since then. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: twilights
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 22:14
| try 20 to 54 per an hour, but there is alot of strategy involved and everyone is learning, u always keep reserves and set traps for incoming armies, alot of feints, alot of fake sieges trying to catch cav troops with spears...the devs did a wonderful job with war mechanics, this is one of the best war games i have ever played, in my opinion war should be a constant in this game, we need a change in illyriad and maybe it was just waiting for us to play it |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 22:55
So if you have 75 players building 288 units in 8 towns it's 172,800 units per day, oops...
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Posted By: Silverlake
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 23:02
It was a joke lighten up, and no one deletes other's posts  ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57338" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Epidemic
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 23:40
This game will quickly fade into oblivion if it became a war game like all the rest. Nobody, I repeat nobody, will play a war game that takes a year or longer just to become competitive. There are 1000s of PvP winner takes all war games out there, this game is unique. Let's keep it that way please.
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Posted By: Sisren
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:00
Words easily said from someone not in Dark. There's a 3rd option. ;) ------------- Illy is different from Physics- Reactions are rarely Equal, and rarely the opposite of what you'd expect... |
Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:11
So who's winning and is it really Illy armageddon?Simple topic, lets get back on it.
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Posted By: Mogul
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:20
I think your guess is about 4 times bigger then reality. 12 units p/h is too much, 5-6 p/h would be more realistic and also 75 players with 8 towns average is too much... only around 30 VIC players where part of war until now. Also I don't know why, but that "tournament ouchies" post has incorrect numbers. For [Druids] it has 4,329 + 8,045 casualties which is less then 50% my casualties alone. Looking here at bottom http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/World/TournamentSquare/37" rel="nofollow - http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/World/TournamentSquare/37 there are fights with 32k , 25k , 17k , ... casualties so for sure not 8k together when defending.
This is at least 6th post from you where you repeat how great "war game" this is... you might be surprised how many players think this is "browser based strategy game" or as massively.com or wikipedia says "city building game".
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Posted By: Aurordan
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:46
Rill posted, and it was deleted. So clearly somebody is. Yes, I realize it's not you.
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Posted By: GM Luna
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:51
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People can only delete their own posts and if I ever do it I always say something. So you can quit conspiracy theorizing and get back on topic in the thread. Thank you. Luna ------------- GM Luna | Illyriad Community Manager | community@illyriad.co.uk 
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Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 02:55
Mogul, I agree the tourney stats are bogus. I fear this presages a major FUBAR when prizes are awarded.
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Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 03:26
One lean and mean (huge) town at 147% still can do 12.68 stalwarts or 14.81 axmen, with two reserve squares, when troops are more important than cows, or when Illy's winter starting in less than two weeks kills the seasonal food bonus.
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Posted By: monkeyfeather
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 04:02
A minor point, and somewhat off-topic, but it's one of my personal bugbears, which I continually push in AC, so I'll reiterate it here. Troops are always more important than cows. Cows, horses, swords etc., all can be sourced from many places, whereas the only source for troops is your barracks, and the only way to make it more efficient is troop sov. In my view, using your limited number of sov squares for anything other than troop sov (or the food/basic res sov required to run so much troop sov) is not using them to their best potential, regardless of any bonuses to adv res production. Sorry to be picking at such a small part of your post dunnoob, but it's an opinion I just can't seem to keep quiet about
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Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 04:26
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I've just (before the tournament) started to play with upkeep buildings, figuring out by trial and error that three clay plots are "suboptimal" for a cavalry parade with two geomancers, the works... :-) IOW, I'm not yet at the point where I must ditch the cows in the huge town. In the old 5 food capital and in the fat towns, yes, food or troops. But there are still times when I have wild mixes of unit types queued, and use the non-food squares temporarily for other purposes.
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Posted By: Gossip Boy
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 05:19
Well, my formula is quite simple build cows during peace and troops during war..... a 25k knights army can be made in 3 months(assuming you can procure the saddles) and that will cost 47.5k gold/hr even with 3 cav grounds and if you aren't involved in a war(which is normally the case in illy) all that gold goes to waste.Thus my suggestion is to build cows during peace time as they don't require an upkeep(you can still build ~10k knights in 3 months) which will require 40k cows for which you require a production rate of 18 cows/hr which requires ~145% prod bonus.This way you will be self sufficient and efficient. I accept this post has nothing to do with the topic of this thread but thats the case with many others in this thread.  ------------- Elessar2 [08:34]<Rill> when you've just had part of your brain taken out, you lack a certain amount of credibility <KillerPoodle> I can say anything I like and it is impossible to prove or disprove |
Posted By: Epidemic
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 07:38
| Can everyone find somewhere other than the forums to discuss your wars? There are other things more important... |
Posted By: EvilKatia
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 07:45
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The topic is pret-ty clear epidemic. if you dont wish to comment then perhaps you shoudl go and put comment on other thread. I think its currently not armageddon but them I'm not involved in thsi war nor is my alliance. As for who is winning we will see when the war ends. ------------- Kat 'They have to always turn a forum post into a badly written book that gives a headache and takes your iq points' - AO |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 07:48
Guess you forgot to read the topic. I'll help : So who's winning and is it really Illy armageddon?I think H? is winning. Consone must by now be figuring out that a leaderless confed is difficult to control. I would guess they would be thinking by now of forming some sort of leadership. I think this is the point H? was trying to make. Having a confed where everyone runs amok is caos and can't be tolerated. There needs to be a controlling body in place to keep the citizens in check. |
Posted By: Epidemic
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:06
| I'm quite aware what the topic is, I can read...Most players only look at Latest Forum Posts, which is cluttered with this war nonsense. Either end it or take the discussion else where, please... |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:07
| I struggle to see how you can talk about who is winning the war without talking about the war? And again it seems you are derailing the topic. |
Posted By: EvilKatia
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:18
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Luna can you possibly tell the people not on topic who can read to stay on topic ? I mean we cant discusss armageddon if those not wanting to discuss it are derailling the topic because this topic happen to be in latest post! To continue on subject, what about those who lost cities and troops ; is this armageddon and end of the game world etc ? ------------- Kat 'They have to always turn a forum post into a badly written book that gives a headache and takes your iq points' - AO |
Posted By: hellion19
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:24
Well I don't feel Consone figured it that way. Some of the earlier posts indicate more so that them being leaderless means that H? doesn't have a certain person to farm. So lets put it another way... So their defense for not having a central leadership that makes decisions for Consone is to avoid a certain person from taking responsibility that will ultimately be farmed in the future when Consone declares war on someone else. Also I do mean future in that if Consone does survive the current war and stays on its current path that if someone in Consone picks a fight then everyone will be dragged into a war then there will be a lot of future wars. |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:38
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I agree with some of your conclusions. By keeping a non leader confed they have no real targets and cant be farmed as such. That seems to help them in this case. However it does mean that if they stay in control and continue in this manner it will mean chaos for everyone and perhaps a true Armageddon for those that appreciate the game for what it is now. I think that H? and DLords + company are well geared to handle this problem and should continue to fight this war so long as Consone sticks to this unorthodox paradigm. It will mean keeping this game somewhat like it is. I can't think that it is a good thing that a leaderless group of people (bandits, rogues, gang, etc.) can be good for the game in general. I say this to the people that are acting like H? is ruining the game. I am a believer that this is a game and it will over time take many evolutions. Sometimes it will be a large gang that is in control (early days white) and it may mean that other times an organized and mostly peaceful group will be in control(modern days H? and DLords). I tend to think that this evolution will swap back and forth as times go along. I do believe that the days for a leaderless rogue group are not yet ready for take over as the previous controlling party has not yet lost control in the least. It is a game that is modeled after reality in many ways and sometimes for freedom to prevail people must act. This will come up again over and over. I would like to personally thank H? for what they are doing to prevent the Consone style of game from taking over.
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Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:44
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This is, boring. Who's winning? Who really cares. Really. ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 08:49
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I care lol... /me kicks lawn out of the forums To me it is important to know that the side of right as I see it is winning. :D
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Posted By: Southern Dwarf
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 09:21
------------- Also known as Afaslizo ingame. |
Posted By: scaramouche
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 10:12
As someone said earlier. Ily is an ongoing evolving game that will take many different paths/routes, some good,some bad, unless things such as this are tried out the game will stagnate..the devs do their bit in changing the game and the players do their bit..one will not work without the other.
I personally dont like to thank H? for trying to stifle a new idea because it upsets their kudos. ------------- NO..I dont do the Fandango! |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 10:47
| I guess agree to disagree here. I think forming the biggest group of non-coherent people that play the game a million different ways sounds like fun to you. I hope that when one member decides they wanna attack one of your cities, and you wish to resist, and the whole confed comes down on you, even though you were not technically in the wrong, you still feel the same way you do now. If not... /shrug... you made you're bed :D |
Posted By: twilights
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:05
| its still too early to actually tell who is winning, hopefully this war continues for a long time. there are alot of warring alliances on the sidelines that will probably be drawn into this. as i mentioned earlier, this side of illyriad game play has been neglected and if others would play these war mechanics they would find that war in no way ruin the game but make it more enjoyable |
Posted By: scaramouche
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:05
------------- NO..I dont do the Fandango! |
Posted By: Alti (SkB)
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:11
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Llyorn doesn't care if H? are winning? Zen training, I guess.
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Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:20
| The fact is when a Consone alliance jumped into things out of place the entire Consone alliance acted to defend them. Is this not true? Not sure anyone will ever know the whole story, but if you know something I am missing please provide the information so I can reform my opinions. |
Posted By: scaramouche
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:33
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you are derailing the topic of this post and only going over repetitive questions that have been discussed in other threads...as a member from TCOL said in a post when one of our members asked why they declared war on us..." mail our leaders with any questions you may have" ------------- NO..I dont do the Fandango! |
Posted By: Rasak
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 11:36
Was only asking for facts you seem to have that no one else does. Sorry for derailing.
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Posted By: Gossip Boy
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 12:07
I guess the above is true coming from a veteran of 'many' wars ------------- Elessar2 [08:34]<Rill> when you've just had part of your brain taken out, you lack a certain amount of credibility <KillerPoodle> I can say anything I like and it is impossible to prove or disprove |
Posted By: Grego
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 14:20
What facts did you miss? If you are lazy to read forum ask all involved parties ingame, please don't make us repeat it all over again here. This topic should be about something else. |
Posted By: Sister Nikki
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 14:29
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Winning in a war is rather wrong question. The only winners in a war are the dead. Illyriad is not made for war. If you like to calculate 25 old cities razed compare to 30 new cities established then you may have a winner as the 25 old cities need too much time to be replaced if you will count only the research. The people in Illyriad who are involved in the war, they more like to use the war mechanics than to really make war for winning. Most of the players are very gentle and polite acting in war with a knight's code and this just proves that the "war" is more to extract a confession which party was "right" and which not. Winners will be many. Winners will be the one who has more patience than the other. Winners will be the ones who will put aside their egoism and submit that they were wrong. Winners will be the teams who worked together bypassing the "war" problems.Winners will be the players who have earned respect for each other. Winner will be the game by the whole experience. Winners will be everyone who have gained knowledge from the whole process. So in Illyriad reality the question is based more in philosophical term instead of reality of the actual situation. Victory will be when people will learn better how to live with each other.  p.s. The best winner is the prestige trade company (allready thinking to buy shares will be cheaper ) |
Posted By: KillerPoodle
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 17:46
You're confusing victory in real life with victory in a game.
Probably the most accurate statement in this forum in a long while. ------------- "This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM "a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 21:15
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pipTwjwrQYQ Duh. ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: Sisren
Date Posted: 17 Nov 2012 at 22:52
And this is how armageddon was averted, and peace realized. Llyorn is the winner. ------------- Illy is different from Physics- Reactions are rarely Equal, and rarely the opposite of what you'd expect... |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 00:59
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Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 01:00
| Nice post Sister Nikki. |
Posted By: Angrim
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 03:35
i don't understand either of these statements. imo, the "Consone style of game" is/was yet to be defined, and as a crow i find the "new approach" they took in creating a large confederation rather familiar. either of you care to clarify?
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Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 05:45
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Please allow me to clarify. I am winning.
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Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 05:57
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I am winning. This is the "last post wins" thread, right?
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Posted By: abstractdream
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 08:05
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No ------------- |
Posted By: hellion19
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 10:56
Interviewer: How do you plan to win that war? Sheen: With Zeal and Focus and violent hatred... Surely my idol.  |
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 11:45
I am not an old player, but I think that Crow federation has a very definite way of playing and it is a large conferation of likeminded (and usually similarly named) alliances, which are largely populated by likeminded people, concerning how they like to play this game. In this regard their style is more or less defined. Consone on the other hand is a bundle of varied and different kind of alliances who cannot even agree on who on elgea is supposed to lead them (will it be a person, many persons, an inter-alliance council, the biggest alliance, who ? ) let alone define a way of playing the game and behaving as a whole/confed. In this regard on the one hand you have groups with leadership, hierarchy, guidelines and accepted behaviours which, should you cross then you will be reprimanded or kicked out, and on the other hand you have Consone that has none of that, so ANY behaviour whatsoever is "accepted" and deemed as "legitimate" since there is no actual rule/guideline to follow and/or uphold ... As a person, having seen real life examples of them, I find such organisations quite disconcerning ...
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Posted By: Ossian
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 12:36
The posts in this thread are pretty much testament that the so called "Great Trove War" is over, not because a particular side won , but because most people on both sides didn't want to fight it.
This war has all but fizzled out. Now is the time for reconcilation and to rebuild relationships ( both individuals and collective alliances) . Lets do that now and start rebuilding trust and friendship within the community of Illyriad...
...good luck all.
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Posted By: Aha
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 12:38
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@Deranzin That's breathtaking nonsense.
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Posted By: Kumomoto
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 12:45
Quite the contrary. I found Deranzin's post incredibly lucid. |
Posted By: twilights
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 13:04
| actually the war continues, its not the slugfest u find in other games, its so much more strategy, its fun to compete against people than just npcs with little ai. war should be a regular part of illyriad, i dont understand why the people that play here are against this function of the game. the devs put alot work into these functions and its a shame that more players are not using a major part of this free online game. good job devs but you should correct and add some things to these functions. maybe if u listen to the reasons why a certain segment of players are so anti-war so you can make changes so they are not so vocal against it and allow the rest of us that enjoy playing not to hear their constant negativity. |
Posted By: Ossian
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 13:12
I have to disagree . Deranzin clearly has an agenda. I felt that his post had more to do with creating an impression than anything else.
No one alliance or confedration is "better" than any other. The simple fact is that they are "different" from each other. There is no point in comparing which is bigger or better than the other... instead we should recognise and respect the differences and learn from them
Vive le difference!
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Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 14:08
It is true that I have an agenda ... it is black, made of cheap fake leather and it has engraved "2012" on it ...
Yeaeh, this is like saying that we cannot compare Greece with Germany, and that Greece is not less organized or it is not worse in administrating its funds, but it is "just different". Nice ! As a Greek myself, I find that attitute quite in my favour ... now, if you believe what you said, lend your money to Greece and buy some national bonds ... Seriously, you can compare between the efficiency of confeds in the same way you can compare the efficiency of alliances, political parties, nations, soccer teams, ping-pong players and coffee shops and whether they make a good coffee or not ... claiming that something is not better or worse than the other similar things in the same category and simply "different" does not exclude it from comparisons ( besides, claiming that something is different is a comparison itself, albeit with no quality comparative value) or evaluations ... If that were not so, I 'd open a barber shop and start trimming people's hair with a sickle and call it a "different approach" to hairstyling ... well, it is different, but it most certainly far worse and inefficient than the other ones and I bet that you'd never visit my barber shop to get a haircut ... Edit: Added a "not" |
Posted By: Loud Whispers
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 14:11
Now, why do you think this is not the case in Illyriad? Honestly if Illyriad became just another one dimensional browser based rage simulators, where the largest, most active and highest paying players single-handedly controlled the only server, myself and a great deal of others would most likely leave and never come back without so much as a second thought. Those pro-war-everyday joke about anyone who protests against these frivolities playing games like Farmville instead, but that's not a due comparison. War in Illyriad is a final endgame tool to pursue whatever agendas you set out to achieve, and even then there are power limits. So many ways to play Illyriad and you'd much rather see it turn into an expensive version of Tribalwars or Evony. The fact that there are even these discussions about the costs of war or the purpose of war is just another example of how deep the sands run in this small box of ours.
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Posted By: twilights
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 15:53
| can we stop derailing the topic. the war is still ongoing, its not determined yet..there alot of objectives alliances are trying to achieve, new relationship are being formed. the status of loyalty of individuals to various alliances are being exposed. we are seeing new alliances being created and a new power base being established. there is so much involved in war, this a complete learning process of a function of the game that has been neglected. the devs are going to be offer suggestions to improve the war functions. good luck to all involved in it, may u achieve your objectives and hopefully we can improve the game play to attract a larger variety of players to illyriad. remember this is a game that the devs have war and conflict as a component . grin, back to making and trading for weapons and all the other logistic things. |
Posted By: Southern Dwarf
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 20:28
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just tell us your ingame name, gameplayer, so we may include you in this war you find so great. ------------- Also known as Afaslizo ingame. |
Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 20:35
Ahahaha of course he won't say it ... don't you know that in real wars the ones that shout the loudest in favor of the war are, by pure coincidence
, the ones that are to old too fight AND they have no children to send to the front .?. |
Posted By: scaramouche
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 20:42
meh..now im de-railing this topic! ------------- NO..I dont do the Fandango! |
Posted By: Sisren
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 20:45
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Same is to be said of you Southern Dwarf... gameplayer is already involved by the by ;) and has been thoroughly involved since the escalation. and if you do one of those things, like pay attention, you can figure out who she is. ------------- Illy is different from Physics- Reactions are rarely Equal, and rarely the opposite of what you'd expect... |
Posted By: Aha
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 20:56
Not only are there large differences between the Crow alliances. There are also many different styles/ways to play Illy, and I bet most of them can be found in the Crow family (which is good).
The Consone alliances are lead separately by their leaderships, quite similar to the Crow confed.
I would immediately quit an alliance that "defines a way of playing" for their members.
The rules of how to behave, or interact with other players, are mainly set by the community and discussed through the diplomatic channels (between alliances or players). Illy is more like a village, you meet people and learn to get along with them quite naturally. No alliance or confederation in this world will say "accepted" when the others are shaking their heads. Concerning Greece: I hope that the country will manage, it's a very hard time for the Greek people. |
Posted By: Herbalist
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 21:02
I may be wrong but I am sure I espy Southern Dwarf's game name in his tag line. And gameplayer is, of course, still in the "twilight zone" :) |
Posted By: Aha
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 21:07
I'm worried though. She posted "this war is fun" so many times, this can't be really fun anymore
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Posted By: Deranzin
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 22:11
It is a lot more complex because, unlike Crow which just got too big and started creating new wings to host its various styled players (they even have an alliance for snugglers :) ) Consone was created "out of the blue" from ground zero and from widely different "materials", simply placed under the same flag which noone knew what it meant and if it would actually mean anything anytime soon. I could be wrong though ... I am not much into illy happenings so I am offering my impression as a "normal"/"casual" player ...
But Consone, unlike the Crow confed, is not yet a cohesive group, as I said above.
And you would join some other group that defined a way of playing that you liked. You are taking that sentence too literally so I will give you an example. My first alliance was Tranquil Vision [Peace] ... their way of playing was a game of pacifism (as name implied) and only defending when needed ... attacks were reserved mostly for tournament ... gathering resources, building up our cities, trading and helping new players was our way (and by extend, the way of the alliance.) That was, in general, their definition of how the game is more enjoyable, so I applied and I joined them. When that credo of PEACE was broken (by none other than the leaders !!), they got KICKED OUT ... the reasons obvious and quite logical ... when you are part of a group and you agree to its rules, then you are expected to uphold them or else you will be reprimanded. And no, you cannot break the rules, even if you were the one that made them ... actually that makes you even more responsible of holding your own rules ... and speaking of which, it is not as if I was speaking of joining an alliance and then they turned a peaceful glade to a battlefield and told you to fight or leave ... you already KNOW what you are signing up for and you are simply called upon honoring your OWN "signature" in the deal for as long as you are a part of that group. If they change their style (their part of the deal) then you can simply go and find others that will play the game according to your style. Do you see anything unreasonable here .?. Does this not happen in the game and in real life as well .?. Is it not, in fact, the basis that most of our lives work everyday .?. Making a choice and then either standing up for it or running away from it .?. I do understand the confusion though ... it is just like political parties and the inability of their voters to understand that the political party is there to represent THEM and not for them to flock under their flag and just give a legal merit to any decisions of the leadership of the political party might make in the future. It is a commom misconception, but, worry not, noone is infringing upon your freedom to play the game as you like ... especially not your alliance, since you actually joined them on your own volition to play YOUR style of the game better
Really .?. Why is this war happening then .?. Why didn't Consone interfere with diplomacy and fairly reprimand their members that got out of hand (I have yet to see something like this, btw) .?. I will tell you why ... because there is not an apparent hierachical structure within Consone and so it works like a mob in a soccer field where anyone can throw a coffee cup at the player making the corner kick and noone will be the wiser as to who threw the cup or why ... Look at this war ... the way I see it, had some ears been pulled early on and some apologies, instead of taunts, been issued then none of this would have happened ... but instead of a central leadership actually leading Consone with a calm and even/fair hand what most of us, as normal players saw, was chaos and mob mentality to "defend our own" without ANY care whatsoever if they were right or wrong. The soccer crown analogy is still good in this case and serves well ... it is like mobs seeing someone wearing the same yellow (for example) T-shirt of your team being beaten but by three blue (for example ) T-shirted people of some other team. On they rush to "save" their like-T-shirted fellow without actually caring if that person had initiated the fight, if he had actually harmed those other guys, if he had had some club or other weapon, if he threw a flare at them and what not ... and then other blue guys see them and suddenly everything is down to who can call up more friends, instead of what was right or wrong ...
Well, it is a very hard time for ALL the global system of finance ... our country just happens to be on the front ranks of this unsettling wave of debt (to whom, I wonder ... if you sum up all that money all the countries of the world owe, to whom is the planet indebted in trillions of Euro .?. Modern economy .?. What a perversion of the original word ! ( eco + nemo = literally means "managing what I have in my house" )) mostly on our own fault. My take on the matter ... we should all close the TV sets (and their daily messages of impending doooooooooooom ) and sit down and think for a while ... I could talk for hours on the matter, but enough derailing ... we are here to chill out from our daily life, not insert its problems to a virtual game ... |
Posted By: Epidemic
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 22:23
| Nobody wins in war, one side just loses less... |
Posted By: hellion19
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2012 at 22:50
That would be more so the matter if there was something to also gain. If you also gain something out of a war and it seems to be worth more than the loss you took I would consider it still a victory. |
Posted By: Hora
Date Posted: 19 Nov 2012 at 00:20
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That's the question... Is there something to gain? Apart from experiance
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Posted By: Angrim
Date Posted: 19 Nov 2012 at 02:55
i would be very interested in your definition of the "crow style". as that is entirely off-topic for this discussion, i invite you to igm.
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