Changed topic.
Printed From: Illyriad
Category: The World
Forum Name: Elgea
Forum Description: For everything related to the Elgea Continent
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=4251
Printed Date: 17 Apr 2022 at 08:33
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Changed topic.
Posted By: Thordor
Subject: Changed topic.
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2012 at 23:08
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Given that TLR is involved in another conflict involving TOR, We've decided now is not the time to raise the issue regarding the ToS. We'll wait until TLR are free from other obligations before raising the issue again. (This change is to assist TLR by not giving them more stress while they are having other issues. [T.R.O] will address the issue again at a more appropriate time).
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Replies:
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:07
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seems to me The Red Order are taking The Short Road outta it, if TLR siege encampments continued why wait till now to complain? horse bolted stables, bit late to complain now don't you think? ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:08
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Hello Thordor of The Red Order, I would like to counter your comments here with my own comments, since it is on the forums I am going to assume it is open for debate. We can both agree that You, Thordor leader of The Red Order agreed to the Terms of Surrender in the war between The Red Order and The Long Road, correct? Looking at the Terms of Surrender which is the Terms you agreed upon acting for your alliance that you were and still are leading we can see there are multiple terms that you agreed to fulfill upon your acceptance, correct? Looking at the Terms of Surrender we can see there is not a clause that dictates the Terms of Surrender is void if The Long Road attacks a The Red Order, army, caravan,harvester, or city, correct? We can also agree a ToS is a Terms of Surrender not a Peace Treaty, a Peace Treaty would have detailed clauses for peace between the former warring parties, not dictate terms that the surrendering party must fill out once accepted by the surrender party, correct? So I am confused as to why you believe that a ToS= a peace treaty or that imaginary clauses stating whatever action The Long Road takes makes the ToS you accepted void. I would like to ask, if this ToS was accepted by you(thordor, the acting leader of The Red Order) on the 18th of July, 2012 and the war against The Long Road started by Aesir sometime shortly after (within 2-10 days) when the attack that The Long Road sent landed on a The Red Order army, why did you speak up now?
------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:24
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EF is right, he broke no rules of the ToS, by reneging on this agreement you are breaking those ToS. If you cannot stand by what you agree don't make those agreements, as in future others will not be so kind as to accept terms of surrender, if you cannot abide by those terms. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Thordor
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:40
Posted By: Thordor
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:41
| I can see where you're both coming from, and I respect your opinions, but now isn't the time to talk about this. We'll review it when TLR are free of other diplomatic situations. |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:45
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Erm Thordor, no disrespect to you but you brought it up, and you also brought it up in GC, it seems to me you are playing games? Is this a serious issue or are you taking the Micheal, as it appears this is just a big wind up to you. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:47
| Thor, I really appreciate you taking this down for the moment. There's only so much I can stand watching Eternal Fire and fromfrak deceive people and create controversy. Since fromfrak's 40 siege engines are yet again busy decimating another town they promised to withdraw from, it is quite obvious what their word is worth. |
Posted By: bansisdead
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:49
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separate issues. Rill if you have a problem with eternal fire, start a new thread instead of derailing this one.
Ok but they are separate issues and should be dealt with separately. This is not the place to discuse TOR problems is it? EF may have annoyed you over other issues, but this issue is straight cut, and irrelevent to the TOR issue, and in that respect shouldnt be confused, imo. and sry if I sound rude, I really dont mean to.
------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/124253" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:49
| I asked him to leave it, bans, I am hoping we can get the issue with TLR and TOR resolved sometime this year, or while Gemley still has a town left. It think Thor raises some legitimate points, but given EF's propensity to confuse every issue, there's no need giving him extra ammunition. |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:51
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It's obvious what they are doing, they are bringing in another topic regarding TLR, in this case TLR is "massacring some helpless person while the treacherous wardogs(TLR) demand more blood" to sway the public who read this, this is the forums remember? I would have thought rill, someone who constantly notes in other forum topics that when a subject is going off topic to make a new topic, you would have done the same here. Edit: chatlog [23:30]<   Thordor> No, Gemley the Dwarf.[23:30]<Captain Kindly> I picked up some tamtam on that. IIRC our guy Baradox was there too, mining? [23:30]<     ropadope> oh dont know him[23:31]< Thordor> He's a nice guy.[23:31]< ropadope> so TLC huh?[23:31]< ropadope> gah TLR[23:32]<Rill> Thordor, please read your mail [23:33]<Rill> yes, that's right kindly [23:33]<Sliveen> Whats the difference between a clash and a fight, on the report? [23:33]<Rill> HUGcr, TOR and EE were sharing a mine [23:33]<Rill> fromfrak tried to take it [23:33]<Rill> when Gemley tried to resist, fromfrak sieged him [23:33]<Rill> Mona broke the first siege [23:33]<Rill> they promised to withdraw all sieges [23:33]<Rill> they lied [23:33]<Rill> again [23:34]<Kilotov> sort it out privately, yes? [23:34]<PrincessTanya> Rill you would believe a promise from Eternal Fire? [23:34]<Rill> I tried that Kilo [23:34]<Belargyle> We had some run ins with Frak [23:34]<Rill> I'm tired of private assurances that are not kept [23:34]<Kilotov> i mean the right way, with armies and weapons [23:35]<Rill> mail thordor [23:35]<  Eternal Fire> harry message[23:35]<Belargyle> Hmmm.. attacking a Dwarf.. REALLY??!! [23:35]<Secret Destroyer> have u researched skinners guild? [23:35]<Kilotov> lol my liege [23:35]< Thordor> Replied------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Thordor
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:55
| Rill asked me to remove it as a personal favour. It wasn't my intention to sway anyone's opinion of the TLR - TOR conflict. If I've at all done that I'm sorry, All I wish to do is convey the decision of the T.R.O high council, which is completely unrelated to all current diplomatic issues involving TLR and various other alliances. |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:55
| This topic currently has no topic, since Thor took it down. I'm sure when he feels like raising the issue again, he will post another topic. Or, if he is wise, he will just let the extensive discussion of this issue on other topics speak for him and drop the issue entirely. At any rate, I don't want EF to be distracted from the actual in-game problem of a small town being hit by 40 siege engines that TLR has promised to withdraw. |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 00:59
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Actually Rill, when the issue with The Old Republic ceases I intend on asking thordor if he will fulfill the remaining terms he has yet to fulfill. He has announced in global chat that he doesn't intend to see the terms remaining through, regardless if he accepted the terms and while I appreciate him waiting till the dispute with TOR to end, I do intend on seeing this issue with the TRO ToS through as well.
------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:03
| Oh, by all means, try to start something with TRO. You broke the treaty -- if you want to start another war, that's on you. But carry out your promise and stop the siege first. |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:08
I do not wish to start something with TRO, I am simple making sure that he understands he accepted the Terms of his alliances Surrender, it is not my fault he did not check to see if the Terms of his alliances Surrender would be void if The Long Road attacked anything wearing The Red Order tag. I have promised Mona Lisa, (eom) Harry and Gemley that I am doing everything in my power to cease the siege on Gemley the Dwarf [TOR]. I have promised Gemley I would help rebuild his damaged city and pay him a few million in gold, I have promised Harry and Mona that while I do not have sitting access to FromFrak[TLR] who has the siege out against Gemley, that messages have been sent to her to recall her siege against Gemley. ------------- Eternal Fire |
Rill wrote:Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:10
| TLR does this every time they back down in a fight. They promise no more sieges, they promise to withdraw sieges, then they keep sieging. If it happens once, it's understandable. If it happens EVERY TIME over a long series of engagements, it's a strategy. |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:12
| Building materials, my butt. I think fromfrak should be required to give Gemley one of her towns. Maybe that would make her a little more cautious about sieging people. |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:19
I'd rather have TLR armies holding mines then attacking someone to be honest, so no it's not a goal of TLR though you are entitled to think whatever you like. I'm going to try and think what other instances this happened in, TLR has been around for almost a year so no doubt I will be a little hazy on some things. TLR vs HEAT, war lasted three days, we gave HEAT the right to lead themselves after the war had been going on for three days, shortly thereafter the HEAT leaders were suspended for some reason and then I captured the alliance capital which was the capital of one of the suspended players, it's still owned by one of my accounts under the name The Real Liberation (a player on the HEAT alliance name when it was captured), although that account is not in TLR. uhh uhh TRO VS TLR, war lasted a few weeks, many feints, so irritating. TLR routed a few TRO towns, war ended w/ TRO's surrender. Still had a few sieges inbound to TRO towns, TRO still had attacks inbound to TLR (one of the things of being two weeks away via siege and siege fient). uhh Aesir VS TLR (then friends) I cant speak for TLR's friends and their sieges still occurring after peace was made, I can say almost all of TLR's forces were spent dying in our towns, we even lost our first town ever, Cheese Enchilada. Sadness uhhh Fromfrak VS Gemley, Peace after a very heavy dispute after it was placed in GC by the defenders for some reason, Fromfrak hasn't been online since. Gemley promised goodies. ------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:24
Well Gemley asked me if he would receive payment for any damage done to his city before Fromfrak's messenger arrives to recall the siege. I told him that I was going to(well actually I said I was planning on sending him millions in gold), to which he said thanks. I then added after he said thanks that I had a city with a built up marketplace so i could help rebuild his town, thus building materials. Gemley didn't comment with a "no, more than gold will be needed", he replied with a "thanks" therefor the millions of gold and the added on building resources met his approval.
------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Sisren
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 01:32
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Terms of Surrender should not be confused with a peace treaty or armistice. Surrender does not imply peace, rather in many cases it implies the opposite. To, after several weeks and into months after accepting one surrenders, to wait while the person surrendered to is busy elsewhere, simply say 'I am not doing this' will have repercussions for your current and future dealings. You will be viewed as someone that will not keep their word. We have but a few currencies here - integrity, trust, and competence. Are you enriching yourself in doing this? ------------- Illy is different from Physics- Reactions are rarely Equal, and rarely the opposite of what you'd expect... |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 02:04
I tried defending my case on GC tonight when I saw you talking about the villainous scoundrels TLR in there again, but it fell on deaf ears. I'm unsure as to why I'm expected to comment on this matter if my comments are not believed. I shall try once more, Fromfrak has not been online at all today, she is not online therefor she can not recall her siege with messengers. She does not have a sitter therefor we can not get on and recall her siege. We do not have anyone close enough with enough firepower to eliminate her siege once leaving TLR for 6 hours, we do not appear to have anyone near Gemley to break the siege that is not affiliated with TLR. Gemley does not appear to have the manpower to break the siege. However much TLR wants the siege to be recalled, we can not. Feel free to continue crucifying us on GC but just know we can't. Gemley asked me if he would receive anything for the damages received to his city under siege, i assured him he would receive millions in gold to which he responded to with "thanks". I take that as a Gemley the Dwarf seal of approval and added in building resources to help rebuild. GC is of course allowed to demand cities of 28k population, or 50k population, or a Ferrari. ------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 02:14
| just two 28k pop cities and a Ferrari, please. |
Posted By: Gemley
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 02:20
EF is telling the truth, and he has promised to pay for damages. Please stop bringing me up in this thread, as much as I am touched by it I intend to not become another joke topic on the forums ------------- �I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend� - J.R.R. Tolkien |
Posted By: Gemley
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 02:27
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BTW: EF my friend Naxos has hired some mercs and he is willing to send them to destroy the seige, which I have told him to do because honestly I don't want too much damage done to my city. To my fellow harvesters that I stood up for; to my knowledge it has been decided that the two mines fought over will be spilt, one going to us and the other to fromfrak. In the next few days hopefully our peaceful harvesting can continue. Hopefully fromfrak has learned her lesson and will not try to take our mine otherwise I would have to kill another 7/8 k stalwarts  ------------- �I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend� - J.R.R. Tolkien |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2012 at 02:29
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Thats fine, in fact I welcome it. TLR will pay for the money required. ------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Fromfrak
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2012 at 19:52
Nice gloating. You never had rights to the mine. You still do not. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/122905" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2012 at 04:15
| Fromfrak, I advise you not to go back on TLR's agreement with HUGcr and TOR. If you attempt to interfere with their harvesting on the agreed-upon mine, there will be consequences. |
Posted By: Juswin
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2012 at 05:36
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LOL fromfrak now trying to wrest away a mine from another player? Nasty. These guys don't learn. ------------- It may be that you are right. Then again, you may be wrong. http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57903" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: ES2
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2012 at 14:01
She belongs to Dlords now, she is no longer TLR. ------------- Eternal Fire |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2012 at 17:15
| Kudos to TLR for standing up to a rogue member. |