Consone
Printed From: Illyriad
Category: The World
Forum Name: Politics & Diplomacy
Forum Description: If you run an alliance on Elgea, here's where you should make your intentions public.
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=3746
Printed Date: 17 Apr 2022 at 04:21
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Consone
Posted By: Jasche
Subject: Consone
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 21:20
|
We would like to officially announce a joint confederacy of 11 alliances in Illyriad called Consone (meaning 'in unison' or 'in harmony'). Our confederacy aims to uphold the Welfare of our Members as the highest law. We will work to keep peace where possible and challenge what we perceive to be bullying or injustice. We will work to connect people, either by conversation or by roads - whatever brings communities together in a productive sense. The confederacy will work to discover the secrets of the land and share these amongst confederate members. We value loyalty, fairness, teamwork and community. We will be considering new member alliances in the future as the confederacy develops but for now we will remain at 11 alliances. We thought it right and proper to let everyone know about our new community. Member alliances are as follows: Absaroke Dwarven Druids Eagles Eyrie Eagles First Flight Fairy Road Authority Knights Temperance Knights Virtue Invictus Sages of Illyriad Victrix Worlds End Kind Regards, Jasche (Consul - Invictus) ------------- 'The Welfare of the People is the Highest Law' http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/14315" rel="nofollow">  |
Replies:
Posted By: Excession
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 21:27
I'm honoured to be involved 
|
Posted By: Mahaut
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 21:32
|
Looking forward to working with you all
------------- 
|
Posted By: RugRat
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 21:37
| Me too |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 21:42
| Congratulations to the new Confederation! Noble goals and I wish you the best in your pursuits! |
Posted By: Daefis
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 23:04
|
Yep, great news. Look forward to the greater cooperation... and hopefully a few in house tourneys :) ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/37796" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Silent/Steadfast
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 23:22
|
Hmm... 11 alliances, each one with a confederation to all the others, that's 55 confederations. ------------- "Semantics are no protection from a 50 Megaton Thermonuclear Stormcrow."-Yggdrassil (June 21, 2011 6:48 PM) "SCROLL ya donut!" Urgorr The Old (September 1, 2011 4:08 PM) |
Posted By: invictusa
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 23:32
Are you serious? EDIT: Oh I see how you got that now. An alliance is confederated with 10 others. This happens for each of the 11 alliances. Since the confederation is shared it is: (Alliance*10)11/2confederation=55 Alliance Confederations
------------- ...and miles to go before I sleep. |
Silent/Steadfast wrote:Posted By: The Duke
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 00:34
|
This has been in the works for awhile, im glad its now official. Thanks to all, for the cooperation and patience ------------- "Our generation has had no Great Depression, no Great War. Our war is spiritual. Our depression is our lives." |
Posted By: HATHALDIR
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 01:34
|
Exciting times ahead for the Premier Confederation of Illyriad, EAGLES are excited to be a part!! ------------- There's worse blokes than me!! |
Posted By: Silent/Steadfast
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 02:35
Happy birthday! ------------- "Semantics are no protection from a 50 Megaton Thermonuclear Stormcrow."-Yggdrassil (June 21, 2011 6:48 PM) "SCROLL ya donut!" Urgorr The Old (September 1, 2011 4:08 PM) |
Posted By: Sgt..Shanks
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 02:44
|
Cheers For posting Jasche, and thanks to everybody for their hard work! Worlds End are looking forward to working together with you all :)
|
Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 03:18
| Oh the drama this will kick up in a few months time... |
Posted By: Garth
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 03:45
 This is a formidable group indeed! Congratulations to all and the best of luck to you moving forward :) Oh, and thanks for taking some of the heat off of us Crows ;)
|
Posted By: Makanalani
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 06:38
Seems reminiscent of one of the World War I alliances. Who is going to be Archduke Ferdinand?  ------------- "Life is a beautiful struggle" -New IGN: Mak (Dark Blight) |
Posted By: Direb
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 09:26
He died in the last tourney  |
Posted By: Babbens
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 10:55
Nice! I wish the Consone Confederation all the best! 
|
Posted By: Ossian
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 11:32
 Good...Goooood...(cackles madly)  |
Posted By: kita od tita
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 12:27
| For a peace loving man like me, this is goos news, congratulations to peacemakers responsible for this treaty. |
Posted By: Dacery
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 13:14
wow i welcome the involvement and look forward to working with all fellow alliances 
|
Posted By: lorre
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 14:24
|
:D jk jk great news! oh thnx sunny for horrible histories i loves it!
------------- The battlefield is a scene of constant chaos. The winner will be the one who controls that chaos, both his own and the enemies. Napoleon Bonaparte |
Posted By: Jabbels
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 14:43
|
Haha (: This is a great thread!! Consone!! ------------- 
|
Posted By: lorre
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 14:44
|
nah honestly i like the idea and i hope it works out well for all those involved. i just had to post it in regards with a comment a bit before this. so anyway goodluck i hope its succesfull ------------- The battlefield is a scene of constant chaos. The winner will be the one who controls that chaos, both his own and the enemies. Napoleon Bonaparte |
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 15:07
|
Zanpur just got a whole lot more interesting. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: Kumomoto
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 15:41
lmao! Congrats on founding the Consone Academy! http://www.consoneacademy.org/Pages/default.aspx I think the work you are doing to develop middle school girls' voices is incredibly admirable! ;) |
Posted By: Daefis
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 15:46
|
lol everyone needs a sideline :) ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/37796" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: jordigui
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 17:03
|
No no, the war started because of an ostrich! TH http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrjHdl-IYPw" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrjHdl-IYPw
|
Posted By: Gemley
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 18:15
|
Brilliant idea. ------------- �I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend� - J.R.R. Tolkien |
Posted By: Silverlake
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 18:36
|
Congrats! ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57338" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Quackers
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 20:03
The duck doesn't want to get killed :( ------------- Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so you will not be dependent on anybody. |
Posted By: Mandarins31
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 21:43
Lol
|
Posted By: Turgor
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 21:43
| Your first on the SuperAlliance BBQ Quackers!! |
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 22:01
Shame you can only see 3 alliance at a time on the tactical map. If you were to light up these 11 alliances you'd be surprised at their regional cover. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow"> |
Posted By: Fonzie
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 22:06
|
LOL hey my 1st message hi everyone
 |
Posted By: Quackers
Date Posted: 03 Jul 2012 at 22:34
I'm sorry but I'm an A1 kind of duck. Get that BBQ sauce away from me! Its orc season anyways, go after them. ------------- Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so you will not be dependent on anybody. |
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 04 Jul 2012 at 01:00
| Quackers a l'orange ... |
Posted By: The Duke
Date Posted: 04 Jul 2012 at 20:41
/me prefers A1 over regular BBQ anyways  ------------- "Our generation has had no Great Depression, no Great War. Our war is spiritual. Our depression is our lives." |
Posted By: Freya
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 12:33
|
hmmmm. I know you've heard me sing..... So you know his work must be excellent :) Bellatrixx
|
Posted By: RugRat
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 13:47
| Hi Fonzie, nice to see you found your way in here. |
Posted By: Mogul
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 20:08
 |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 20:25
|
Welcome new evil overlords of Illy. Harmless looks forward to relinquishing the crown. ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: Garth
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 20:38
Wait, you mean we skipped the part where the Crowfederation were evil overlords? Shoot. Guess we just had a little reign as "there's too many of the buggers, how do we get them to self-destruct." Oh, well, we'll take it!
|
Posted By: SugarFree
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 20:39
|
is this true? why the heck are invictus and victrix hanging out with those losers???
------------- Nuisance |
Posted By: Hora
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 22:07
Ehm.... if you can actually read, Sugar, try out that link... http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/Alliance/Favorites" rel="nofollow - http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/#/Alliance/Favorites
That might explain a lot...  Or take a look at that impressive map Mogul posted in here... amazing work, btw |
Posted By: Jasche
Date Posted: 05 Jul 2012 at 22:44
|
Thanks for all the feedback guys. I was surprised it took so long for a world war reference But Hitler hasn't been mentioned yet on the positive side.... ...damn it! ------------- 'The Welfare of the People is the Highest Law' http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/14315" rel="nofollow"> |
Posted By: RugRat
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 08:25
| Nice map Mogul. Nicely done. It shows the situation very well. |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 08:32
|
Kumo bet me $5 dollars I wouldnt make a cold soup joke. 'Gazpacho?' Nope, I wont go there. Wont stoop. And no I don't 'trust a personal cheque' Moomoo. (If it helps I amuse myself) ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 09:10
|
Posted By: Gragnog
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 11:52
| So much speculation, so much mumbling. As to why WET is not there, nah, you can just keep on guessing. As to new evil overlords of Illy? Was there ever an old one? Again it is the few conspiracy freaks trying to see evil and pain where only good is intended. |
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 12:51
you have powers I can only dream of. ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow"> |
Posted By: vty
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 13:20
Um, what?
|
Posted By: SugarFree
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 13:21
|
try paste a crow map.. u would be surprised ------------- Nuisance |
Posted By: Juswin
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 13:35
|
Ouch mister sugarfree :)) ------------- It may be that you are right. Then again, you may be wrong. http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57903" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: Prometheuz
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 14:01
|
On reading this thread there have been a lot of varying comments. I think the first thing to say is that we must congratulate all those who worked to put this initiative together because this is more or less a first in the development of game play in Illyriad (others will claim it is not...but to all intents and purposes it is). It must have taken a good deal of work, planning and thought to have achieved this. I think that it is a very ambitious iniative but so long as the alliances stick to the fundamentals of sovereignty negotiation then it could well be a success. If it has amibitions beyond that then I think it will not succeed. There are too many alliances with competing concerns and varying motives involved and frankly as a military confederation it will not stand a hope in hell if starts to punch above its own weight. Sugar Free has picked on a key issue within the thread and I would like to develop it here. What is of interest is the way that Invictus has chosen to deal with the resolution of sovereignty/Land claims ( because this was surely the reason for CONSONE). Unlike H? They have chosen a more flexible approach rather than trying to invent a "must observe or else" 10 square rule. There iniative is even more flexble than DLords ( excellently drafted but still a land claim ) Statement . As I say . What is of interest is the way that Invictus have acted here. Is this the crossing of the Rubicon that we see? |
Posted By: vty
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 14:20
| I guess you have to ask them |
Posted By: Mogul
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 14:39
This is thread about Consone so I will not do it, but as you seems to believe that crow confederation has more land or population I guess you would be surprised... All numbers are there in alliance list: Invictus 6,652,561 Worlds End 4,507,163 Knights Virtue 3,670,309 Eagles Eyrie 3,282,692 Victrix 2,978,900 Absaroke 2,760,689 Dwarven Druids 1,294,150 Fairy Road Authority 1,179,734 Eagles First Flight 1,049,006 Knights Temperance 371,819 Sages of Illyriad 229,260 ------------------------------------------- 27,976,283 For crow confederation that would be something more than 20 million population. |
Posted By: Sgt..Shanks
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 14:51
|
Regarding WET... It is a Training alliance that may or may not join the Consone when it has a little more to offer, not that this is really an issue to many, but those involved. |
Posted By: Mandarins31
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2012 at 17:33
|
Prometheus, you're right to question about Consone's ambitions and about if it will "succeed". Basically, Consone is an attempt to give more sense to the word "confederation", in Illyriad's world. Consone is a ring of confederacies. All alliances are in confederation with each other. It differs from what we often have over Illy. I think it also differs from Crows coallition, in the fact that Consone is formed with alliances of various horizons; there is not a head leading it (well, im not sure how is the leadership organised over the Crows coallition, so i can't compare), it's a place of discussion where we hopefully will be able agree on what to do, or how to be organised, in various circumstances. It means for exemple to improve trade between the confederates, work out territorial policies within Consone members, work out player-made tournaments, eventually be able to express a collaborating opinion about important events over Illy, ... hope it gives you some lights
|
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 07 Jul 2012 at 07:50
|
You know how long that 'cold soup' joke took me to write?! Lotsa time! Lotsa! And not even an 'YKFBNRBOASLWCYFBOHBTCFALNMFI!' For ma troubles!!!! ('Yeah Kinda Funny, But Not Really, But Overall A Sympathy Laugh Will Cost You Five Bucks, Okay, How Bout Three? Change For A Looney? Nah Man Forget It!') ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 07 Jul 2012 at 20:27
The Crowlition is not controlled by any one person. Each alliance is entirely separate and has individual leaders for each alliance. That said, they also operate differently and are much different from each other. Really no different from the consone by the sounds of it.
|
Posted By: Cerex Flikex
Date Posted: 07 Jul 2012 at 22:51
|
Wellness, and good fortune upon you! ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/149824" rel="nofollow"> 
|
Posted By: Rorgash
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2012 at 21:59
|
I will make sure to prepare my troops for the coming World War against tyranny and oppression you will bring Orcs Gather for the Biggest WAAAGH in your Life!!
------------- 
|
Posted By: The Duke
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 03:42
|
Just to clarify- does this mean your ppl are oppressed and you are a tyrant? I believe so ------------- "Our generation has had no Great Depression, no Great War. Our war is spiritual. Our depression is our lives." |
Posted By: dunnoob
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 04:19
|
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 05:59
 I am a tyrant and I oppress all of Illy.
|
Posted By: Daufer
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 15:52
They say the road to Hell is paved with good intentions... Well, let us see where this one goes. Hopefully somewhere with more water and better society. Good luck.
|
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 16:23
The greater good ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow"> |
Posted By: Hora
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2012 at 17:13
Better dancing around a warm fire, than sitting up on a chilly cloud trying to sing to an harp |
Posted By: Silent/Steadfast
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2012 at 01:49
()=added []=deleted (when) I [am a ty]rant [and] I [op](de)press all of Illy. ------------- "Semantics are no protection from a 50 Megaton Thermonuclear Stormcrow."-Yggdrassil (June 21, 2011 6:48 PM) "SCROLL ya donut!" Urgorr The Old (September 1, 2011 4:08 PM) |
Posted By: LordOfTheSwamp
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2012 at 05:07
Consone = Sanford Neighbourhood Watch Alliance?! The shocking truth is revealed! ------------- "A boy is building sandcastles on a beach. You go and kick down his castle. You could say that it only reflects how you play with sandcastles. Others may think it reflects who you are." - Ander. |
Posted By: Prometheuz
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2012 at 10:53
What? - this is in poor taste and verging on dubious politics to say the least! I am surprised at you Kudruk |
Posted By: LordOfTheSwamp
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2012 at 12:30
Hey, I've got a Sanford Neighbourhood Watch T-shirt! (It's slightly worrying how many people think it's real, and don't realise it's a movie reference.) ;-) ------------- "A boy is building sandcastles on a beach. You go and kick down his castle. You could say that it only reflects how you play with sandcastles. Others may think it reflects who you are." - Ander. |
Posted By: JimJams
Date Posted: 17 Jul 2012 at 22:58
|
It will be interesting to see how the confederation will work next tourney. Hoping they will release a tourney after the summer. |
Posted By: N. Chadgod
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2012 at 01:27
After?  ------------- It's beyond fairytale, it's inconceivable! |
Posted By: vty
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2012 at 04:14
| Consone will try and win all the tournaments!!! |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2012 at 04:25
|
'After!' 'After what?' 'After after!' ------------- "ouch...best of luck." HonoredMule |
Posted By: JimJams
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2012 at 13:59
Who is the goalkeeper ?? :-)
|
Posted By: Gilthoniel
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2012 at 14:04
|
^^
|
Posted By: geofrey
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2012 at 15:40
Who do I have to give my money to to get one of those shirts? ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/45534" rel="nofollow"> |
Posted By: Silverlake
Date Posted: 24 Jul 2012 at 21:41
The guy with the different color shirt and gloves ------------- http://elgea.illyriad.co.uk/a/p/57338" rel="nofollow">
|
Posted By: LordOfTheSwamp
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2012 at 13:01
Last Exit To Nowhere: http://www.lastexittonowhere.com/shop/product/nwa/" rel="nofollow - http://www.lastexittonowhere.com/shop/product/nwa/
------------- "A boy is building sandcastles on a beach. You go and kick down his castle. You could say that it only reflects how you play with sandcastles. Others may think it reflects who you are." - Ander. |
Posted By: Salararius
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2012 at 15:50
Yes, hilarious. Because, there aren't people in the world who would wear something like this and NOT be referring to the movie. Someone who thinks that MUST be living in a dream world  |
Posted By: Mara Zira
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2012 at 18:44
|
I apologize in my delay in posting this, but I've been a bit busy in real life. I've noticed that there seems to be some confusion about Consone. The alliances within Consone had been allied directly or through their confederates for some time before the above formal statement made by Jasche. At some point, the idea was suggested that we formalize this confederation between the alliances so that each was directly confederated with the others rather than leaving it as a loose webwork of confederated alliances. This formalizing of existing ties was an internal affair to tidy things up. The formal formation of Consone was not done in reaction to anyone else on the game. As a part of this, one leader tried to find the principles that the various alliances held in common and attempted to create a statement describing the confederation.
"This is a new confederacy of 11 alliances in Illyriad whose mission is to uphold that the Welfare of our Members is the highest law." This indicates a mutual defense pact. I assume all alliances exist to protect their members, and all we're stating is that this confederation--like most confederations--will defend each other if attacked. Members may also take this to mean mutual assistance through sending basic resources to each other for free or filling each others orders on the market before selling res for a higher price or otherwise helping each other out. "We work to keep peace where possible and challenge what we perceive to be bullying or injustice." We tend to be peace-loving players, so we work to keep the peace through diplomacy. However, there are things we are willing to fight for, like protecting those who are weaker. However, it will take multiple leaders from 11 different alliances to all agree that action is required before Consone as a whole would act beyond mutal defense. "We work to connect people, either by conversation or by roads - whatever brings communities together in a productive sense. The confederacy works to discover the secrets of the land and share these amongst confederate members. We value loyalty, fairness, teamwork and community." We hope that the goals of the individual alliances in the conferation (ROADS intends to create roads for everyone to use, SAGES wishes to discover and share knowledge with everyone on the game, etc.) will encourage people to work together and will increase everyones enjoyment of the game. While it's natural to favor your close friends (those in the confederacy), our goals do not end solely with our own benefit but with everyone learning, connecting, and enjoying the game as a community. I hope this actually helped to clarify things. |
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 08:41
|
DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU ARE PREPARED TO WASTE TIME WITH A LONG POST. --- I would like to begin by saying that I didn't even know there was this confederation until tonight when it was being discussed in Global Chat. While I was away I did not check up on the forums or read about the happenings in Illyriad (and there was too much to sort through when I returned). That being said, I would like to comment on this entire thread. --- First, I would like to bring up the war with the former Valar alliance. It began with one cry for help in Global. One player (Lorre) swiftly took a stand for what they believed was the right course of action. I stood with my former alliance leader and sent all the troops I had to defend this new player from constant attacks and sieges. I cried out for help in the forums - but no help came for days. Meanwhile, there were alliances talking behind the scenes. At a later time, when war was waged against former Valar by Amroth, this confederation finally banded with the joint purpose of taking a stand against the many injustices that they had witnessed.
With that said, I appreciate seeing this preemptive action which will get the ball rolling once a major issue does arise. At least there will already be an established forum for communication.
More than this, you have created an "in" group and an "out" group. If you are in, you share in all the benefits (protection, trade, shared knowledge, etc.) but those on the outside are not benefited at all. I almost want to join because you have stated that you will share information about the Illy mysteries among your Confederates. Though I am not calling your confederation this, I would like to point out that this is how cults begin.... Furthermore, what happens if one alliance breaks away because of a personal issue of pride or a personal vendetta against another alliance and the Consone Confederation chooses not to back them. If they break free and wage war once the whole Confederation has disapproved of such action, then that one alliance then becomes the enemy. They become the oppressors and then the remaining Consone Confederation would be obligated to take them out (thereby preventing injustices). What I am seeing (right now) is a Confederation of 11 alliance heads. No doubt the Confederation will use an Teleological ethical model: They will look towards the end goal and decide the best action to achieve that goal. Most likely a Utilitarian model where they will attempt to ascertain the greatest amount of good for the greatest amount of people. The problem I see with this is that you can easily justify pretty much anything if you have a confederation of 11+ (and growing) alliances. You become the greatest amount of people and you will then determine what is best for your Confederation. Perhaps there is one leader or a group of leaders in each alliance who all have a voice in this Confederation. What you are speaking of derives from an Authoritarian model of ethics: basically you determine the best action for all 11 confederates and dictate to your alliances what the verdict is. If they follow this model then there should be little trouble. That is if all the members of your alliances blindly follow commands. I take issue with this because I do not follow anyone blindly. I like to know what is going on and why I am attacking another player in the game. I don't just siege first then ask later. --- Have any of you seen the show Avatar: The Last Airbender? What you need (rather than this all encompassing Confederation) is to ask those who stand for fairness and equality to join and become part of some sort of "White Lotus" guild. Every alliance could have White Lotus members within their ranks. It doesn't need to be secretive - but it would state that this player is a free thinker who seeks fairness and equality for all. There would be no need for confederations or creating "in" groups or "out" groups. Basically, each member would inform their alliance leaders that they reserve the right to act as they feel is right...that they are not drones who follow orders blindly and would rather their alliance leaders do all the thinking for them.... I like the idea you have here, but I fear for the future of Illyriad when one alliance is scorned by another...and the Confederation decides to take a side. Might will never make right - even with such a large Confederation. (P.S. I believe we have found the reason Alliances are limited to only 100 players and not thousands upon thousands) --- Final Dislaimer: I am speaking for myself alone and am not a representative for the views of any other player or alliance. -------------
|
Posted By: Kilotov V2.0
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 09:58
could not be avoided. it's common knowledge that if one of our allies goes to war we will always follow. it was a sad spectacle, but it could't be helped. a confederation is more than a fancy thing to put on the diplomacy page in our opinion.
|
Posted By: invictusa
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 10:09
|
As you have admitted, you have been away for quite awhile. It must be an undertaking to understand all these new updates and at the same time prepare what you obviously wanted to portray as a viable opinion on the matter.
You see this as a problem because you are not involved and think that it is meant to police your actions? I hope not.
And yet you came to the rescue of your alliance's resident GC drunkard by backing him up by making an arguably offensive post in a thread which was meant to celibrate something beautiful. Consone leadership does not act in a tyrannical manner. Is that what you were proposing? I hope not.
Are you high?
While you were gone on your holiday your alliance (and their 1 confed?) were completely and utterly attacking newby resource occupations all over the map because they were dealt a foul hand in resource populating and were slow to act in order to claim them. Silverlake, for instance, hilariously posted an entire thread incriminating his own confederacy. Or at least calling for it. Speak some sense to your alliance. Post this link in your AC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6UAYGxiRwU" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6UAYGxiRwU
Cheers buddy
------------- ...and miles to go before I sleep. |
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 14:44
|
Oh my.... I am sorry Invictus, but I was looking for answers to concerns raised - not for someone to ask me if I was "high." Both uncalled for and distasteful. I am not concerned about someone policing my actions because I always act on what I believe is right. But the concern was that policing will take place on a grand-scale. As for my attempt to portray a "viable opinion on the matter" by "making an arguably offensive post," I cannot understand how these realities were not mentioned in this post before. You completely sidestepped my warnings and past experience dealing with the coordinating of several alliance heads and chose rather to attack me for my questions and concerns? I made an attempt to contact HATH about this, but the mail was read and not responded to. Thus, I am asking here. Furthermore, you mention a past forum thread and then post a link to a youtube video "You're So Vain" - I would have found the link to that thread much more useful.... But thanks anyway. (>.<) Finally, until this was brought up in GC last night, I had heard nothing about it. I did a forum search for "Consone" and read up on the matter. I was not coming to anyone's aid, rather I wanted to ask legitimate questions regarding legitimate concerns (which it seems were not brought up in the entire thread). And what do I get from a representative of this Confederation....shameful in my opinion. Since I seem to have offended you, it was not my intention and I am sorry. Since your post was equally as offensive and sidestepped the major issues I was asking about, I hope more of the Consone leadership will speak on Consone's behalf. original post below (taken at the time of my post)
-------------
|
Posted By: Kumomoto
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 15:52
| Who is being offensive in your "beautiful" thread now? It is good to see the true bitter face of Soup emerge and not it's sanitized, pg scrubbed version. |
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 16:30
|
Keep in mind that Invictusa is only one voice of many in this Confederation. I would like to hear from others as well. -------------
|
Posted By: Gossip Boy
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 16:55
What would you like to hear? /me remembers all his grandma's bedtime songs and stories  ------------- Elessar2 [08:34]<Rill> when you've just had part of your brain taken out, you lack a certain amount of credibility <KillerPoodle> I can say anything I like and it is impossible to prove or disprove |
Posted By: Nokigon
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 17:42
|
I have been reading this thread with great interest. Here are my two cents. Firstly, it confuses me as to why invictusa reacted so angrily to the earlier comment by SunStorm. All of Consone's reaction so far has been calm and peaceful, and this mars an otherwise peaceful thread. I'm curious as to whether SunStorm touched a nerve, whether you're in a bad mood or whether you're feeling somewhat paranoid about public opinion to Consone. Whatever the answer is, there was no need to insult Harmless and their members (I assume that you're calling Llyorn the drunkard?) and call SunStorm high. It's below the belt and frankly immature. Secondly..... Consone. SunStorm is right, they are indeed potentially the most powerful group in the land. They could well if they wished become the new 'tyrants' of Illy. However, they're not going to do so for a number of reasons. Firstly, because they know that they could be defeated by Harmless and the Crows if they wanted to. Secondly, because- judging by my dealing with the members of this group- they are not aggressive, attacking people. And thirdly, because it wouldn't achieve them much. There is another point, though. There is a mixture of feelings about this, which can be split into two groups- alarm, and approval. The ones who approve of this think that they will be pretty harmless, but will help to safeguard the atmosphere of peace in Illy, whilst providing protection for newbies simply by their presence. The ones who feel alarmed fear that they will push their own alliance further down the ladder towards obscurity- in my opinion, of course. It is interesting to see the levels of paranoia some people have about this.
|
Posted By: Ander
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 19:15
|
As always, appreciate your thoughtful posts Sunstorm. Jasche is the person to contact for anything official regarding Consone. I'll share with you my perceptions about the things you mentioned -
There is no 'out' group. For one, member alliances have diplomatic relations outside consone, which were founded based on friendships and shared histories.
Any Illy mystery I discover, I will share with anyone. As Mara Zira said, "our goals do not end solely with our own benefit but with everyone learning, connecting, and enjoying the game as a community." From your past actions, I kind of know you think the same way too. :)
We encourage all alliance members to be part of consone. They find new friends, neighbors and trade opportunities there. Consone is a wide community, not a cult of alliance heads. You could ask about this to any of your friends who is a member of a consone alliance.
The 'model' is more like a meeting place for friends than anything else. The points you make are very valid, if consone is to change it's colour later and devolve into a political organization with narrow agendas. The chances fior such an awful development is very low. We as a community (including me, you, Dick and Jane) has more free spirit in us than selfishness. :) |
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 19:22
Prometheuz commented on this as well:
There are varying reasons why this would fail as a military confederation. Mainly, there is never any "Just War." Both sides always argue that they are fighting for the right cause. My reasons for attacking someone may not look "just" in another's eyes, but I would not be attacking unless I felt justified. Therefore, how can a Confederation of 11+ alliances ever chose a side in a matter? They will end up siding with those most like them. If someone like, oh...lets revive an old incarnation, Attila the Hun was attacking someone (mostly only the vets know of this older player, so I will leave it at that) and he was standing on the side of justice, who would come to his defense? What if he were fighting against Eagles Eyre? Or worse yet, First Flight? What if he had been legitimately wronged and would not back down from what he felt was a "just cause?" This Confederation wouldn't side with him over their own. My concern (and I feel it is a legitimate one) is that this is an unbalanced force that would side with friends and confederations above what is right. What if someone was under siege and you felt like they needed help? What if they cried out in global that they were being oppressed? I once laid siege to a player who attacked one of my siege camps on another inactive and unaffiliated player. (FYI, I was still in {P A} at the time.) I gave him 3 days to respond and reimburse my losses and I messaged his alliance leader as well. The alliance leader kicked him and told me it was my decision what I wanted to do. My alliance gave me the same approval. The player sent me a rather rude and disrespectful reply. I stuck to my word and waited three days...then sent out a siege to his city. I did not raze his city, merely left it at 0 population and then left. (It was his smallest city and under 500 pop I believe.) Had someone attacked my siege on him - oh, I would have been very upset. If you go down that path of using military action where you have no business and are lacking all the facts, then your Confederation will have failed at their goal. This is my concern. Has anyone noticed that, at the time of this post, the post in the thread with the most "Thanks" is this one:
I appreciate Mara Zira clearing this up for the past two months or so, but what if the weaker party is in the wrong?
Now last night my alliance's "resident GC drunkard" (as someone so lovingly put it) brought this up in global. I sent the following message to HATH: ****mod edit to remove private messages**** (This is my own message to share and does not need to be deleted. I desire to share it and there is nothing confidential that should lock down this thread. Furthermore, this message can be confirmed by Hath if there are any questions.) Hath and I have had great communications in the past, so I decided to ask him since he was on at the time. I have not heard back, but this probably means he is busy in real life. The root of my concern is that this seems to have been formed shortly after Harmless was involved in razing an inactive player's city and then demanded compensation because active players attacked armies which were attacking an inactive city without even contacting them prior to sending troops. Harmless got a lot of grief for this and now there is a Confederation which seems to want to "challenge what [they] perceive to be bullying or injustice." Now let me be blunt: What is the real reason for this Confederation? Why place that in your slogan and state that it has been in the works for some time now? It seems to me like a reaction to that whole inactive player ordeal. I didn't agree with all the politics involved there, and perhaps it was a matter of pride more than anything else since both sides seemed to have had their pride hurt; but does there need to be a Confederation established to challenge bullying when they will never have all the facts on the issues that are truly important? Again, If my siege had been attacked because someone felt the need to meddle and police against injustices (Yes, I was a larger player sieging a smaller), then I would have been furious. If any military action is made by this Confederation, there will be repercussions beyond what anyone can imagine. Do you see any other alliance policing the others? Or any other Confederation of 11+ alliances? It is overall a bad idea. If nobody else wants to say it then I will. A bad idea. This is what I would like to hear: Can Consone's leadership please speak on this and possibly modify your mission statement - either that or be specific and clear about your intentions. I do not look forward to a global war, but I will not stand by while 11+ alliances loom over my head and watch every action I make while deciding for themselves whether it was right or wrong - then exacting punishment for what they decide are wrong actions... Once again, I am not a representative for any other player or alliance. I am speaking to my own concerns on this matter.
-------------
|
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 19:25
|
P.S. sorry if this seems like I am going off the deep end (>.<)
Edit: Oh, and thank you to those who are willing to address these concerns and clarify the standing of this Confederation in regards to any military action. -------------
|
Posted By: GM Luna
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 19:36
|
The rule against posting private messages is universal and it does not matter the origin or context. Please just do not post them ever for any reason. Luna ------------- GM Luna | Illyriad Community Manager | community@illyriad.co.uk 
|
Posted By: Rill
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 20:18
|
Re posting of IGMs: I am not suggesting that people attempt to evade the rules, merely suggesting an option that would appear to be within the rules. If I am wrong about this, I hope that Luna or some other GM will correct me.
|
Posted By: SunStorm
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 20:22
|
My message was basically showing that my concerns last night match my concerns in that post. I asked if Hath knew anything about this Confederation and if he could tell me if it was in response to recent actions (now actions that are more than two months old). That is about it. If you read the post without the mail, you can kinda guess at what was there. -------------
|
Posted By: Ander
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 20:27
Was it such a great injustice to cause several alliances to come together and form a confederacy?
You think formation of consone was the reaction to some petty issue Harmless had with someone, and not something that came out of long standing friendships we had between each other? That is placing H at the center of universe and assuming everything revolves around them.
Have you seen consone policing anyone?
I hope your opinion will change over time.
I can assure you, nobody is looming over your head and watching your actions. Everybody is involved in their own business. What is the point in asking someone to change their mission statement? If you go through the mission statements of different alliances in their profile (start with 1 and follow the order), you will find many references about how they bring doom upon their foes. You should judge people by their actions, not their mission statement. Where did all this paranoia come from? |
Posted By: Gossip Boy
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 20:31
|
I kinda knew that already.but thanks anyway for confirming Now let me be blunt: What is the real reason for this Confederation? Why place that in your slogan and state that it has been in the works for some time now? It seems to me like a reaction to that whole inactive player ordeal. I also thought that it was an inactive player ordeal but as you are giving so much of your time in writing long posts about it i am convinced its much more than that. You are not a fool,right? If any military action is made by this Confederation, there will be repercussions beyond what anyone can imagine. Do you see any other alliance policing the others? Or any other Confederation of 11+ alliances? It is overall a bad idea. If nobody else wants to say it then I will. A bad idea. Has someone ever told you that meddling in other's affairs is a bad idea.NO? okay i am telling you this time that meddling in other's affairs is a bad idea I am not a representative for any other player or alliance. I am speaking to my own concerns on this matter.
(applies to me as well )------------- Elessar2 [08:34]<Rill> when you've just had part of your brain taken out, you lack a certain amount of credibility <KillerPoodle> I can say anything I like and it is impossible to prove or disprove |
Posted By: Ander
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2012 at 21:27
|
Just one more clarification .. It all started when Enjin provided a guild site and Invictus was willing to share it between the confederates. Folks started meeting each other and someone prompted a discussion for a wider confederacy. At least, that is how I came across it. :) |