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Printed From: Illyriad
Category: The World
Forum Name: Politics & Diplomacy
Forum Description: If you run an alliance on Elgea, here's where you should make your intentions public.
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=2060
Printed Date: 16 Apr 2022 at 21:36
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: ___
Posted By: Kumomoto
Subject: ___
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 06:15
Deleted.




Replies:
Posted By: Erik Dirk
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 07:39
I don't really have much interest in settling the areas H? seems to be around but just out of interest, if a H? player is within say 20 squares of a faction hub do we still need to seek permission to settle near them?
 
I'd also Like to point out that while it may seem like a small area a 30 square radius actually equates to almost 3000 squares , per town we need to ask permission to settle in (ignoring overlap). (actual area is 2827 per town)


Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 09:01
Now lets see,H?,BIGGEST alliance in Illy (using the generally accepted method of ingame rankings),telling the rest of of Illy i.e. all other SMALLER alliances and much SMALLER individual players,not to settle in particular areas of the map.
 
Definition of a Bully:A person who is habitually cruel or overbearing, especially to smaller or weaker people
 
 
Any resemblance?
 
Dunno and honestly don't care what H or anyone else lay claim to, but don't anyone ever complain about people being bullied in this game because H, the non policing body of this game have drawn an interesting line in the sand here folks.
 
Now I know what I say now won't stop the replies however I will say it anyway, I don't condone big players picking on small or new players but it is gonna happen no matter what. Players such as Lorre I say congrats for sticking up for the little guys,  what Duq has demanded from Berberos is no different to what H is demanding from the rest of us, the only thing we don't know for sure is whether H will employ force to get their desired result,time will tell.
 
So good luck H on achieving your goal,I doubt that many if any will test your metal on this one but as I said,the line has been drawn so everyone else stake your claim now.


Posted By: Thexion
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 09:34
You just added that "or overbearing" to the Webster dictionary definition. Interesting.


Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 10:05
No I didn't actually but no doubt there are many different and varied definitions,
 
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/bully" rel="nofollow - http://www.thefreedictionary.com/bully


Posted By: Thexion
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 10:19
http://mw1.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bully
so they did it in the free online dictionary



Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 10:49
I like defintion 1 A actually.Lol


Posted By: Aneirin
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 11:20
Originally posted by Kumomoto Kumomoto wrote:

All:

I think it's imperative that I post that H? will not be happy with folks dropping cities within 30 squares of any existing H? city outside of the 500/500/500/500 perimeter. As much as we get along, we just also need to claim our territory...

Which means that H? cities in the center of the map are not included.

Please do not do settle a city within 30 squares of an H? city and if you must, please notify the H? city member who you are going to live near and get his/her prior. Failure to do so constitutes a right to relocate you.

The bottom line is that we believe in close alliances and if you choose to place your city within that radius of an H? member, then you are definitely a neighbor and we need to work together.

We also would appreciate it if you do not populate your cities in the Kadu Peninsula, near us in the Lakes Region, or on the Tal Island... If you are there already, you are, of course, expected to stay there. We really are not referring to the Eastern half of Tal, either...

But please do not hesitate to contact us with any questions or concerns...

H?


 
 
This message is typical of Kumo and typical of H? The  message is probably directed at the increasing number of new players looking to relocate from the centre. The alternative is that H? are looking to attack someone in those areas already and working on a way to give it positive spin.  H? like to portray themselves as the newbes best friend and others as bullies. Don't believe it for a moment
 
 NEWBES BEWARE YOU ARE SEEING HARMLESS? IN THEIR TRUE COLOURS! 
 
Don't trust Harmless? and don't trust Toothless?


Posted By: Lord fosster
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 11:30
It just keeps getting better... 


Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 11:47
I dunno bout that Aneirin, but boundaries have definately been made in more ways than one. There are no ingame rules being broken here but it is catorgorically outlining that size is power and that is the hierachy from here on in, this is a break away from the traditional views expressed by the community judging by previous arguments,should be interesting at the very least.


Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 12:05
At first I thought this was a joke,then I saw what forum it was in. I suppose that shows how much I care about H? territory claim...

Have fun dealing with the vast majority of the community that does not read the forums.


Posted By: Gemley
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 12:40
Honestly I dont care what H? claims or says. There are some of their members in my alliance's(Gondor) territory and I will be telling my members they dont have to listen to what H? has  just said and they can settle their citys where ever they want to, near a H? city or not.


Posted By: Erik Dirk
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 12:48

If we're going to bring morality into it I think we should let H? actually clarify what they mean first.

If they exclude these settling limitations around places if interest it changes things entirely. And it also depends on how strongly they plan to enforce this claim, I.e. is the claim theoretically there for everyone, but in practice only applied to alliances and confederations that could actually be considered a threat.
 
Having said that, the land claim is on a huge scale, EACH TOWN roughly claims 1/3 of the TOTAL D lords land claim. Also pointing out that a 30 square radius has more than double the are of a 20 square radius.


Posted By: Aneirin
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 14:38
MORE SHAM THAN REALITY

Taking into account Mr Damage's and Erik Dirk's comments, the problem as I see it is not so much the issue of Land Claims ,because that is not what Kumomoto and others such as Llyron of Jaensch are really after and I would say that Kumo's post shows the true nature and desires of H? ie to dominate  and subordinate all others to their  will. Those boys love to attack , siege, dominate and humiliate. To them that is what Illyriad is about.
 
To the slightly (but only slightly)  more rationale members  of H? like Creature for example Land claims are the way forward for H? "even more so when pathfinding/tolls/walled areas and many other planned features might/will be implemented" by the development team. This latter point should not be lost on Mr Damage and Erik Dirk whose alliance Prisoners of Society (O-O) is surrounded by H? on 3 sides and DLords on the other. What will O-O do when those H? members around them start settling into Arran and claim a 30 square sov area around those cities on grounds of  "lebensraum". That could spell the end of O-O
 
Contrast Kumomoto's very brief, take it or leave it, statement above with Dlords Land claim 25 January 2011 (see link below) which  attempts a more reasoned and rationale approach and even has a procedure and declared aim to help new players who find themselves in what Dlord claims as it "Home Territories".
 
http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/dlords-claiming-of-space-for-home_topic1481.html" rel="nofollow - http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/dlords-claiming-of-space-for-home_topic1481.html

H? have not presented any draft terms for resettlement for consultation as DLords did. They have not even said that such players who find themselves in that position will be given a warning by H? Instead players are told to contact the nearest H? player in question. What if you are Newbe or don't read the forums. What then?
 
 In theory, the first you will now about is when your Town icon on the header display suddenly displays a red warning for an incoming attack. Or your quartermaster reports that you have been raided. That's Kumo's reality !
 
No if Harmless? wanted to try and legitimise their land claim, they would have presented a detailed set of proposals for consultation. Making Land claims on the basis of forcible removal alone is a bad precedent to set. Other alliances should have nothing to do with this sham in its present form.


Posted By: Starry
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 14:43
lol, I suspect people do not realize that Kumo is just kidding.  :P  For the record (and those that are taking this seriously) H? has no policy to this effect.

-------------
CEO, Harmless?
Founder of Toothless?

"Truth never dies."
-HonoredMule



Posted By: Manannan
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 15:02
Originally posted by Starry Starry wrote:

lol, I suspect people do not realize that Kumo is just kidding.  :P  For the record (and those that are taking this seriously) H? has no policy to this effect.

Though Starry would know much better than I and pretty much confirms my suspicions, I do suspect this is actually Kumo (and Fluffly in his thread too) taking the proverbial pee out of some current Illy affairs.... not naming any names! 

Check other threads in the (Bitter Sea) forum if your confused but if you are the question begs to be asked... Where the hell have you been? Timbuktu? 



-------------
Doesn't look good... doesn't look bad either!

"Manananananananananan, so long Sir, and thanks for all the fish." ~ St.Jude


Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 16:39
I guess there needed to be more flamboyant display of tongues firmly planted in cheeks this thread. Tongue

But indeed, consider this as the satirical commentary on other recent events which Harmless intended.  We are absolutely not making any territorial claims at this time, nor have we been considering making such thus far.  And if we did, you could rest assured we'd try to find a more reasonable approach, and certainly not make blanket radial claims applying to all our cities wherever they may be.


Posted By: Kumomoto
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 16:40
I guess noone saw the tongue in the cheek... :(


Posted By: Zangi
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 16:51
Its easy to ignore when you are part of the #1.  Care to forward the original text to me?  I'm interested in seeing it.

And yea, I understand its supposed to be satire.


Posted By: Manannan
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 16:53
Originally posted by Kumomoto Kumomoto wrote:

I guess noone saw the tongue in the cheek... :(

LOL, It did have me wondering for a second till the caffine kicked in. LOL


-------------
Doesn't look good... doesn't look bad either!

"Manananananananananan, so long Sir, and thanks for all the fish." ~ St.Jude


Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 21:35
Nice work! I reckon this won't be the last we hear of it though.Just reading between the lines.


Posted By: Erik Dirk
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2011 at 23:34
even if it was meant to be a joke i'd still like to add that the bullying claims aren't neccessarily true.
when white fell it would have taken atleast the three largest alliances to take on H? however now crows could agruably rival them, and in a few cases a single diplomatic tie would be enough to have H? totally out gunned. Therefore if they had made an unreasonable claim like this it could only be called bullying if it also applied to alliances outside the top 10


Posted By: Ander
Date Posted: 22 Jun 2011 at 04:29
Originally posted by Kumomoto Kumomoto wrote:

I guess noone saw the tongue in the cheek... :(

LOL


Posted By: Mr Damage
Date Posted: 22 Jun 2011 at 10:17
Thats an entire different scenario Erik,but I think discussion here is finished for the moment.



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