TMM Crusade
Printed From: Illyriad
Category: The World
Forum Name: Politics & Diplomacy
Forum Description: If you run an alliance on Elgea, here's where you should make your intentions public.
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=1293
Printed Date: 17 Apr 2022 at 05:22
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: TMM Crusade
Posted By: Metallicus
Subject: TMM Crusade
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2010 at 12:40
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Hail Mighty Warriors of Illyriad, As most of you must now know the guild known as "The Mal Motshans" declared war and began hostilities against "United Orc Scourge" at midnight gmt approx. Dark Blight have answered the call to arms and are now attacking TMM with all forces available. US are also defending themselves valiantly. Dark Blight did not seek this war and are only involved as we are honour bound to protect our brothers in US. We also attack in the memory of Grog/Shrapnel. Members of T? are also involved in this conflict but it will be long and bloody. Our aim is not the destruction of TMM as this would make us just as bad as them. Rather we wish to show them that the notion of "Join us or die" cannot and will not be tolerated. I call on all warriors of good heart to join us in this worthy cause. Let the good citizens of this world show the would be tyrants that this game is for all to play regardless of time served or location entered. For obvious reasons i will not detail tactical intel here so if anyone wishes such info then mail myself ingame. We seek not to shame anyone into joining the fight. Freewill is afterall the reason we fight, Support of any kind from any player or guild in either moral,material or military guise will be gratefully appreciated and not forgotten. I thank you all in advance and wish everyone happy hunting. ------------- Proud Warboss of Dark Blight |
Replies:
Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2010 at 18:10
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Many alliances are taking up the fight against TMM and hostilities should be relatively brief. In the interest of coordination and properly directed response, we as a community should try to maintain a list of active TMM combatants and accurate accounting of their individual grievances. I humbly propose that http://illyriad.honoredsoft.com/wiki/UK1:TMM%20Crusade - Arcanum Illyria would be an appropriate place to maintain such a list as well as any other public record of consequences dealt. In order to wage a fair and properly restrained war, it is necessary to always remember what we are doing and why, which requires a running tally/comparison of properly attributed (per individual) actions and consequences. |
Posted By: -hypocritical-
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2010 at 18:20
and if my army returns intime, I will help out :D
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Metallicus wrote:Posted By: Metallicus
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2010 at 19:12
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Basic info posted in the Arcanum. I will update as i get more intel.
------------- Proud Warboss of Dark Blight |
Posted By: Metallicus
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 13:50
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Hail again Mighty Warriors of Illyriad, TMM have collapsed under the weight of public opinion and action. The war against TMM is won but the hunt for the criminals is not over. TMM have lost but have not surrendered so there is still work to be done. Having said that i want to publically thank all the Guild Leaders who chose to declare for the side of right against might in this sorry tale. Without the tremendous support from the community of Illyriad,US and Grogs legacy would have certainly fallen. I am sure Shrapnel/Grog is looking down and approving on how the world came together in this darkest of hours and said NO to the tyranny of TMM. I personally am proud to have stood shoulder to shoulder on the field of battle with so many esteemed warriors from so many different guilds and with so many different philosophies. At the end of the day we all reached the same conclusion and forgot past differences. For this i thank you all. ------------- Proud Warboss of Dark Blight |
Posted By: Zangi
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 13:55
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Yea... so... translation: Individual members didn't 'surrender' to most likely ridiculous terms... after/when their alliance folded. Solution: Continue knocking them down and taking their cities. I'm proud to have been able to gangbang legitimately with all you guys. It was fun. |
Posted By: Nokigon
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 14:00
Don't need a translation, it was just eloquently written. Made complete sense.
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Posted By: Metallicus
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 14:07
You are entirely entitled to your opinion on my post mate. I will point out that we have however demanded nothing other than US are left in peace. That simple term has not been agreed upon. My apologies for any confusion. I do however note you were not so vocal when TMM were "Gangbanging" US ?? ------------- Proud Warboss of Dark Blight |
Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 17:02
Was that the only demand or the only demand made by your alliance? |
Posted By: G0DsDestroyer
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 19:01
Maybe he feels left out he didn't get any action, unless someone payed him to attack ------------- http://live.xbox.com/en-US/MyXbox/Profile?gamertag=G0DsDestroyer" rel="nofollow - Tia mi aven Moridin isainde vadin |
Posted By: Nokigon
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 19:16
The only one made by our alliance- everyone else has their own vendettas
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Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2010 at 20:36
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I cannot speak with complete knowledge of all that may have transpired, but what knowledge or evidence I do have gives no indication of any other demands having been made by any of the participating alliances. All I have heard is that Nige hunkered down for war and got on with it. He hasn't even peeped on this forum. If there were another side to this story, nothing prevents him from sharing it. Besides, the rules change when one goes to war. If anyone had reason to believe a trustworthy resolution could have achieved, we'd not be here. Now we are. It's too late to play the reform card (not that any such attempt was even made anyway). |
Posted By: some random guy
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2010 at 04:14
| The Commonwealth's members voted yes to supporting the allied forces attacking TMM. Unfortunately, TMM was destroyed before this conclusion was reached. (That's the problem with democracy in a world where wars take a few days.) |
Posted By: Nokigon
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2010 at 08:29
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somerandomguy, TMM has been defeated but AVa64, Nige and ragmanon have simply fled the sinking ships. They still must die for their crimes. There is still sport to be had. |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 08:32
1st Statment: Baseless assumption proven false 2nd Statement: Ignorant snide comment. Where EXACTLY were you Zangi when TMM were 'Gangbanging' the US? Zangi your sideline commentary is uniformed, childish and generally ignorant. It is not clever nor witty. Personally I'd be embarrassed If I posted the above. |
Posted By: Shuey707
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 08:39
Only term was to leave US alone. They didn't want it, and decided to attack unprovoked. Not a word has been heard from TMM since, and even though the alliance has collapsed, the main offenders are still alive and kicking. AVa64 and Nige have set up shop in the Laoshin Region, probably hoping to avoid being wiped out there as well. |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 08:47
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Oh and a small post script. Zangi passing moral judgment of the actions of others involved in a war. The guy's a mercenary for Christ sake. Can someone say hypocrisy? |
Posted By: Shuey707
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 08:49
HYPOCRISY!!!1!  |
Posted By: G0DsDestroyer
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 08:55
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Yea... so... translation: Individual members didn't surrender to generous terms... after/when their alliance folded. Solution: Continue knocking them down and taking their cities so they don't rebel again. I'm proud to have been able to supress TMM with all you guys. It was unfair, but necessary. I think this is a bit better  ------------- http://live.xbox.com/en-US/MyXbox/Profile?gamertag=G0DsDestroyer" rel="nofollow - Tia mi aven Moridin isainde vadin |
Posted By: Zangi
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2010 at 19:46
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Don't believe I've ever said I wasn't a hypocrite. Feel free to do something about it if you don't like it. |
Posted By: King EAM
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 01:02
| /me grabs 3d glasses and popcorn.... |
Posted By: Llyorn Of Jaensch
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 09:59
I believe deconstructing your 'argument' was doing something about it. Otherwise what did you have in mind? After class behind the gym? |
Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 22:35
 If Llyorn were a wind-up toy, he'd be a huge hit. I'd have one in every room. |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 22:37
HM - Really? You like wind-up toys _that_ much?
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Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 22:50
| I like anything with scathing wit. It reminds me of me before I got married--back when telling the truth was sufficient speech control. |
Posted By: G0DsDestroyer
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 22:59
I'll take 10 please  ------------- http://live.xbox.com/en-US/MyXbox/Profile?gamertag=G0DsDestroyer" rel="nofollow - Tia mi aven Moridin isainde vadin |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2010 at 23:54
Ain't that a mouthful! Our wives hound us about being more open...but then they get their feelings hurt and it's our fault...once again. ugh....But life without a wife is not an acceptable option.
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Posted By: SirTwitchy
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2010 at 00:26
| yup, the dirty clothes and dishes would get downright annoying and I would have to move, if it wasnt for SWMBO |
Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 10 Dec 2010 at 21:14
| your basically copying TMM here, beating them into oblivion, they've learned so just stop attacking them |
Posted By: nvp33
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 01:28
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First off Con Orc, TMM doesn't exist anymore, they disbanded the alliance. Second, we've found out that most (if not all) of the large accounts that were in TMM is controlled by the same player, via sitting and having more than one IP adress so he doesn't get "tagged" for it by the mods. Thirdly, Nige and his accounts are resettling in a new area far from the MM region and noone is attacking those cities. Fourthly, we haven't attacked any of the smaller members of the former TMM alliance, only the large ones who attacked first, destroyed a city and would have destroyed more if not for the fast response of several alliances. And fifthly, If you were the leader of a small alliance with neighbours who were very aggressive (I don't mind an attack or two, but sieging into oblivion is out of line) and who were so big that any one of the accounts could wipe the floor with your entire alliance. Then you wouldn't just prod them with a stick a bit and say "Well I guess they learned their lesson", wait untill they attack again and then hope that you could manage to convince dozens of alliances to come to your rescue again. Lastly let me say, as HM has also said, there has been no contact or attempt of diplomacy of any kind from Nige since he sent his first attack. If there had been I would have read it, and replied in the same manner and spirit which he sent it. But there has been nothing but silence. |
Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 01:58
| hmm i agree, but these rumors of nige and his multiaccountings- mods dont track via multi accounting, they can track people down by how they play the game. ask them yourself. |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 03:25
| TCO - These are true statements regarding Nige. |
Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 03:55
| then the mods and gm's would have handled it. |
Posted By: Nokigon
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 17:07
| I'm not going to argue with you TCO, but has it not occured to you that either the GM's are, or there isn't enough proof? Nige, AVa64 and Ragmanon are the same player.Fact. |
Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 20:45
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question- do you have any hard evidence?
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Posted By: Brids17
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 21:33
The mods can check IP addresses so if he does have multiple accounts they'll know for sure. Unless he's signing on from work or at a friends house for different accounts, though that seems like a lot of work just to have more than 2 accounts. |
Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 21:37
| again I say this, IP adresses aren't what they look at, it's a contributing factor. Take me for example, I have two brothers in my house, they played this game too. |
Posted By: fluffy
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 22:47
| having multiple ip adresses isn't hard...I use multiple on a daily basis, school, home, my cell provider, thats 3, or 6 accounts right there...Im sure the GM's have a way to find out, and Im hopefully sure they wont tell us how they do it...that only makes it easier for people to try to get around it. |
Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2010 at 22:56
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It is possible to legally control up to 6 accounts: two that are directly owned, and for each of those, two more that are accessible through account sitting. Whatever the current situation, it is likely that most of the accounts were originally built by different players. As a result, heuristic analysis would likely not identify commonalities between the accounts. And if the extra accounts are controlled only via sitting, then technically nothing wrong has occurred and any action taken by a GM would lack clear justification. Thankfully, we don't need GM's to weigh in on this. Our evidence may be circumstantial, but the level of correlation of these circumstances ranks as highly suspicious. And since controlling more than 6 accounts will signal the GM cavalry, Nige remains well within our capacity to redress. Finally, our primary beef being with the actions of these accounts and not their ownership, we needn't concern ourselves with solid proof of the latter. It is sufficient that our belief informs our tactics and understanding of the enemy. |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 12 Dec 2010 at 01:27
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"It is sufficient that our belief informs our tactics and understanding of the enemy." That is very well put, HM.
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Posted By: The Con Orc
Date Posted: 13 Dec 2010 at 18:15
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[QUOTE=HonoredMule]It is possible to legally control up to 6 accounts: two that are directly owned, and for each of those, two more that are accessible through account sitting. Whatever the current situation, it is likely that most of the accounts were originally built by different players. As a result, heuristic analysis would likely not identify commonalities between the accounts. And if the extra accounts are controlled only via sitting, then technically nothing wrong has occurred and any action taken by a GM would lack clear justification. Not so, Shrapnel once said, he was accused of mutli accounting by the gm's, because he often sat for his wife's acct. obviously he cleared up the matter. but the point still stands. ------------- Guitar Jesus! |
Posted By: HonoredMule
Date Posted: 13 Dec 2010 at 18:47
| Con Orc, Shrapnel's home IP would have been accessing both players' accounts and Shrapnel himself would have been influencing how his wife's account(s) were managed. Of course that is going to appear suspicious. Noting that the accusation did not result in sentence only proves his actions did not violate game rules. Shrapnel was probably saved by the discovery of differing patterns that could be distinguished between his wife's behavior while logging in directly and his own while sitting and managing his own accounts. |
Posted By: The_Dude
Date Posted: 13 Dec 2010 at 22:00
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I think that Shrap's issue arose _before_ two important Illy developments:
1) Rule allowing 2 accounts per player had not been implemented.
2) Account sitting had not been implemented.
TCO - Here's the most important matter...If you think Nige is innocent, then send your armies to his cities to help defend him. I reckon he will need to be in your alliance to do this. So send him an Invite if you wish to be his champion.
Secondly, if you think he is being mistreated, then do not participate in the attacks. Just keep your armies at home.
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Posted By: Makanalani
Date Posted: 14 Dec 2010 at 04:49
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While I agree with the overall justification surrounding the destruction of the TMM, I'm noticing an increasing sense of hostility towards Illyriad members who are merely looking for an elaboration and "hard proof" of Nige's multiple accounts (which I understand is impossible). Reading posts over the last month on forums I have come to respect the opinions of the consensus. Yet, increasingly I think the value of opposition is being lost amongst the hasty formation of arguments against war. There must always be someone to question the legitimacy of actions, for without it, unchecked tyranny would reign over Illyriad. Not many informed people argue with the actions of Harmless, Dark Blight, etc. But, patience should be exercised beyond a coy, "So send him an Invite if you wish to be his champion". TCO may have an argument that is not widely recognized or even one I agree with to be quite honest, but at least he fills the capacity of a verbal check and balance on the current trend of counter-aggression. I must express the highest respect for the Dude on forums and insist that this is not an attack, but rather food for thought:). -Mak ------------- "Life is a beautiful struggle" -New IGN: Mak (Dark Blight) |