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HonoredMule View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 22:24
It only takes one cheater who knows what he's doing to ruin the game for everyone else.  Pointing out a few idiots who manage to give themselves away by slipping details to other players or leaving an electronic trail that they could have avoided doesn't change the effect caused by the ones who are not.  Where prevention fails, you have to consider broader approaches, such as removal of the incentive to cheat.

I've played other games where the incentive to cheat was high and the developer was AWOL.  Sure, cheaters still got caught by the snooping of fellow players...some of them, that is.  Yet even the ones who were caught often enjoyed multiple years of unchecked success while they harassed small players and alliances.  And, they were still only caught because they were sloppy.  One player was a member of my own alliance and was never discovered during a very long and respected tenure in a position of leadership.  We only found out because he got bored and quit, but decided to confess all before doing so.  It was a painful stab in the back to find out that some of our most successful operations were supported by clandestine cheating.  Destroying his account and distributing the spoils to smaller players did little to lift our spirits.  Forum and datanet logs were clean...we'd have never caught him without the confession.

At the end of the day, what difference does the rule make to you?  You're allowed to run two accounts just like everyone else, so what's the problem?  Don't thumb your nose just because it's different or unusual.  In a perfect world, anything possible is legal--then cheating itself becomes possible, and everyone is on fair and equal ground.  In an imperfect world, that is still the ideal.

No doubt the developers of this game will find and ban many cheaters using more than two accounts.  But all the anti-cheater detective work in the world doesn't change the price of tea in China.
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rescendent View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 20:53
Originally posted by <span =Apple-style-span style=font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; line-height: 21px; font-size: 15px; font-weight: bold; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 1px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 1px; >Illyriad Admin</span> Illyriad Admin wrote:

1. You may only have 2 Illyriad accounts per server that you play on.
2. Towns set up largely for the purpose of sending resources to your primary town are not permitted. If you infringe this rule you will receive a warning, and if you continue to infringe this rule, a suspension or ban.
Its not like the rules permit lots of accounts, only 2 - and they have to be active accounts - not farm accounts...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 18:54
Most crimes are solved with help from tips... People report the multi and the admins look into it and then make a judgment call. Its not hard to figure. When multiple people use a computer you can easily tell the difference between them.

You wont catch all of them and maybe not most of them. But there will be fewer if its not allowed and that policy is enforced. Plus they will have to work harder to be undetected, making it less appealing.

I am well aware of the ways around IP and other detection methods. I think you would be surprised how many dont use those techniques. Plus there are other ways to catch them and in fact, basing judgment on IP alone is a bad way to enforce this. IP can be one piece of evidence though.

I have played at least 6 other games like this one. None of them allowed multiple accounts per person. They all allowed for multiple people on one computer. They all banned hundreds if not thousands of accounts for this and other forms of cheating.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 16:09
Originally posted by GM Stormcrow GM Stormcrow wrote:

Originally posted by Telemikus Telemikus wrote:

Hola,

Also most of the players from Webfusion all play on the same IP address.

If this was limited most of us wouldn't be able to log on :(

Hey Telemikus,

Just borrow the server's IP address - we can't block that one WinkBig smile

EDIT: For those who don't know, Webfusion are our (truly wonderful, excellent, beyond compare) server provider and hosting company for the gameservers.


Why thank you very much, we do our best :)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 14:23
joekewl, it's not hard, it's impossible.  Rules that only restrain the honest do nothing but widen the competitive advantage cheaters have over honest players.  While many honest players hail from the same IP address, cheaters will have no qualms taking the measures needed to bounce different accounts through different proxies--many of which could be privately and invisibly run on residential IPs indistinguishable from that of any other honest single player.

The only reasonable reactions the devs can pursue are:
 - Disallow in-game activities that bring multi-account benefits to fruition (no feeder accounts).
 - Heuristically search for patterns that multiple lone accounts are run by the same entity or scripting system.  Multiple lone accounts that are actually maintained by hand generally still cannot be discovered, but are at least limited by the capacity of the cheater's hands-on efforts.

Running two accounts is hard but everyone can do it.  Three is getting dicey...I have my hands full  with one.  The rule honestly seems strange to me even--but it bears far less importance than we would project upon it, if you take enforceability into account.  Pragmatically, it's far better to give honest players free reign to achieve accomplishment more comparable to what cheating can net.  At least that makes cheating a less lucrative proposition.
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GM Stormcrow View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 12:06
Originally posted by Telemikus Telemikus wrote:

Hola,

Also most of the players from Webfusion all play on the same IP address.

If this was limited most of us wouldn't be able to log on :(

Hey Telemikus,

Just borrow the server's IP address - we can't block that one WinkBig smile

EDIT: For those who don't know, Webfusion are our (truly wonderful, excellent, beyond compare) server provider and hosting company for the gameservers.


Edited by GM Stormcrow - 08 Apr 2010 at 12:07
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 12:05
heh, understood Joe.

As I say, I think corp will change the rules to one account only for later servers. But what do I know :)
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Telemikus View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 12:05
Hola,

Also most of the players from Webfusion all play on the same IP address.

If this was limited most of us wouldn't be able to log on :(
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 11:52
I know people steal and that its hard to stop them but I want a law against it anyway. Most crimes are solved by tips...

No game ever says its easy to catch them but because its hard doesnt mean you condone it.
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GM Stormcrow View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2010 at 08:02
Originally posted by joekewl joekewl wrote:

haha, ok, if thats how you want to call it. Its not about multiple people... there are provisions for that as well. Its about multiple accounts per person. It is a difficult thing to police but I know of several players with more than one account. They are the same player not spouses or roommates.

It's not "a difficult thing to police", joe - it's an impossible thing to police if an individual is determined to run multiple accounts on the same server - and pretty much any game (that doesn't require a client download or licence key system) that tells you otherwise is simply not being truthful.  I think you'd be surprised at the number of players with multiple accounts on the same server in games that supposedly "enforce" a single account rule.

So yes, we could have put in an unenforcable, arbitrary rule that "people can't have multiple accounts on the same server" when both we - and they - know this is in practical terms an impossible rule to monitor or enforce.  Or we did as we did, bit the bullet and said "we permit this on this server" which is what we preferred to do.


Edited by GM Stormcrow - 08 Apr 2010 at 08:03
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