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dunnoob 
Postmaster
Joined: 10 Dec 2011
Location: Elijal
Status: Offline
Points: 800
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 Topic: Mining changes
Posted: 10 Sep 2012 at 10:19 |
Darmon one, devs nil. 
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Darmon
Forum Warrior
Joined: 15 Aug 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 315
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Posted: 10 Sep 2012 at 05:09 |
The last Q&A with Massively (towards the end) gave me an impression that the devs put a lot of time and effort into historical accuracy and realism (well, as much as can be expected of a fantasy-inspired game).
That being said, I find it really strange that the rare minerals replenish themselves and respawn. Is that how real mines work? Are they just bottomless pits of resources that refill themselves if you look away long enough? Or can resources be mined-out and new deposits discovered?
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Granek
Greenhorn
Joined: 13 Aug 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 63
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Posted: 08 Sep 2012 at 17:48 |
 hellion19 wrote:
2. Id rather not have the NPCs majorly strong rather I would like to see something like quite a few goblins come out and attack... if its not guarded they will easily kill the miners. If you have guards there it will be safe to assume your going to take some losses from it. I also wouldn't mind seeing some presence around herbs also from random raiders and bandits as well... |
The NPCs could scale, with the amount of ore mined increasing the chance of something spawning (relative to it's max amount); the longer the time between triggering NPCs, the greater the chance of something really nasty appearing.
And/or 'natural' events could occur, such as mine cave-ins killing a few miners, increasing the variety of events. For example, deepsilver mines hold 3 ores at a time. Every time 3 ores have been mined, the chance of triggering an events goes up by 1%. When an event is triggered, one of the following happens: - Event trigger resets to zero, with no other effects.
- Flash flood: miners are okay, but they lost some of the ore they had mined.
- Mine cave-in: a few miners killed.
- Mine raid: a group of goblins raid the mine, driving the miners off unless there is an army parked there. No ore retrieved.
- A small vein of a different ore is struck, producing a random mineral that mining trip.
- Mine invasion: a large group of goblins invade the mine, killing all miners unless there is an army present.
- Creature from the pit: the miners delved too deep down a mine shaft, breaking into the lair of Something Nasty. The Something Nasty stays on the spot until killed, or it despawns.
- Etc, etc.
hellion19 wrote:
4. Not really a fan of this one either. It increases supply side and hurts the market a bit instead of just letting things run their course and watch how the players handle it. Instead those in the mountains will still be able to get a massive boost on the mining side of things while the addition for everyone else would be minimal at best.
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If the extra amount mined also contributed to triggering random events, the benefit of extra ore might be outweighed by the increased frequency of events: the chance of 500+ miners being killed due to Something Nasty appearing, meaning 500 hours of re-training new miners, would be a nail-biting time for any mining magnate.
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hellion19
Forum Warrior
Joined: 01 Aug 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 310
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Posted: 08 Sep 2012 at 07:22 |
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1. I wouldn't mind things shifting around a bit as it will make politics more interesting as the initial release of all the materials will be more of a regular thing and it promotes conflict between people and guilds.
2. Id rather not have the NPCs majorly strong rather I would like to see something like quite a few goblins come out and attack... if its not guarded they will easily kill the miners. If you have guards there it will be safe to assume your going to take some losses from it. I also wouldn't mind seeing some presence around herbs also from random raiders and bandits as well...
3. Not really a fan of this one. It just gives a strong advantage to those that the location spawned close to them. Otherwise anyone further out doesn't get the same benefit... I feel that mining or gathering of herbs should be more about who has access to the square and controls it rather than turn it into over complicating it with having to sov also.
4. Not really a fan of this one either. It increases supply side and hurts the market a bit instead of just letting things run their course and watch how the players handle it. Instead those in the mountains will still be able to get a massive boost on the mining side of things while the addition for everyone else would be minimal at best.
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Darkwords
Postmaster General
Joined: 23 May 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 1005
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 22:31 |
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It is unlikely those holding mines will continue to do so for all time to come, some will forget to re-occupy in time, some will just get bored, others will get a stupidly high stock of certain minerals and want something different.
If you look around the map there are also still a fair ammount of unoccupied mines available.
Apart from these matters you should consider what will happen during the next tourney (or if a multi alliance war broke out), it is likely that many of the occupied rare resources will become available again.
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geofrey
Postmaster General
Joined: 31 May 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 1013
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 19:45 |
Rill wrote:
They were not randomly distributed, some types of minerals are supposed to occur more frequently (or possibly even exclusively) in certain areas. And even if the distribution was "random" it was at best pseudo-random based on computer-generated randomness, which is of course not truly random. |
There are obviously rules that dictate what resources CAN appear on what squares. For example it seems all rare minerals must be on a mountain.
I believe there are also certain geographical rules, like Ice Heart can only be found in squares north of a particular point.
Then I believe there are distribution rules, like pyrestone has a 30% chance of being in a Keshalia mountain, but a 10% chance of being in a Middle Kingdom mountain.
All of these rules were decided on by the devs, put into the resource spawning engine, and then someone clicked "GO." And then resources were spawned. Not 100% random, as there are rules governing
Arguing about distribution is pointless as it has already happened. I hope we can come up with some suggestions for future enhancements to mining nodes (like my beautiful list on page 1) that can add more fun into mining.
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Rill
Postmaster General
Player Council - Geographer
Joined: 17 Jun 2011
Location: California
Status: Offline
Points: 6903
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 18:44 |
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They were not randomly distributed, some types of minerals are supposed to occur more frequently (or possibly even exclusively) in certain areas. And even if the distribution was "random" it was at best pseudo-random based on computer-generated randomness, which is of course not truly random.
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Bonaparta
Postmaster
Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Milky Way
Status: Offline
Points: 541
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 18:40 |
JimJams wrote:
I don't think the initial rare resource distribution was casual. So I don't think they are going to change anything... |
I've run some analysis of rare mine distributions in regards to the terrain - mountains distribution. There is only about 20% chance that they are randomly distributed. I think devs distributed some rare mines randomly and some were manually placed.
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JimJams
Forum Warrior
Joined: 20 Sep 2011
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 496
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 16:24 |
I don't think the initial rare resource distribution was casual. So I don't think they are going to change anything...
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Granek
Greenhorn
Joined: 13 Aug 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 63
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Posted: 07 Sep 2012 at 16:12 |
Rorgash wrote:
its only stagnant because some wont go to war over them :) if or when groups starts wanting to get more of them as they figure out what is needed to make the things they want and their value, but for now we wait |
And for a lot of people, it may be that it is more beneficial to them to not harvest at all. Whatever is mined, or crafted, will ultimately find its way on to the markets.
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