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KillerPoodle View Drop Down
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Points: 1853 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KillerPoodle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 05:17
Dave - I specifically asked my directors and members to stay out of this thread so that no-one would feel like H? were piling on. 

If it would really make you believe that what I say is true and that I have the backing of my alliance I would be happy to have them contact you via IGM - send me a message if you would like that.

Hora/Vanerin - welcome to my world for the last 12+ months.
"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM

"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill
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KillerPoodle View Drop Down
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Originally posted by dittobite dittobite wrote:

KP, please get your stories straight.  First you claim I'm not the real ditto.  You go on about that until nobody is really paying attention to that and then you change your story to Ditto is completely out of the loop.  Please stay consistent.

It's perfectly consistent - you showed yourself in a place which could not easily be faked by a sitter. At which point I understood that you were you and acted accordingly. Changing your view of the world based on evidence you receive is a fundamental part of a logical and scientific approach to things. I even posted in GC that it looked like you were really alive :)

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The only reason Hath posted in the forums was because of H? rejection of terms 2 times which we offered them, not that H? ever asked for terms.   If H? is now actually interested in terms for surrender, feel free to IGM Hath or me and we will give the terms for H? surrender.  I have told you this multiple times now and have yet to receive any IGM regarding those terms.  


I rejected two of your three terms 8 days ago - to which you did not respond until today - with vitriol I might add.

Since then a lot of posting (on both sides) and thinking (on my side at least - you may speak for your side) has happened which culminated in this thread that reversed that initial rejection. A thread which was posted before you responded to my IGM from 8 days ago.

I was the one who IGM'd you a link to this thread containing my proposed terms - if it is really necessary to copy and paste them into an IGM as well then I will do so now - it seems a little petty/silly though - I presume you can read them here and respond in IGM if you really are interested in finding a way to end the war.

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In regards to being concerned for your allies, I recommend defending their cities next time you insist they stay in a war with you rather than letting their cities get razed left and right while building up to defend your own.  We already placed in our initial terms that H? help the Dominion (your former allies) rebuild.  Those terms were rejected.  I think your allies might appreciate their cities being defended rather than a odd terms of surrender post made by the surrendering side of the war placed on the forum.    


Our allies can confirm that we did what we could to help them while you were doing your best to wipe them out. We achieved many city saves and nice take downs all through the war - facilitated mainly by poor tactics on your side.

I don't recall seeing those terms to which you refer - maybe you can remind me (through IGM if that is your preferred communication method).


Edited by KillerPoodle - 02 Jul 2014 at 05:57
"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM

"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill
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Mr Damage View Drop Down
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Points: 598 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mr Damage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 06:27
Ok I'll admit I only read the first 3 pages as it quickly turned into crap. In a few words, KP well done, the offer is a good one excepting the gold payments either way. Neither should pay an exact amount, it may be more it may be less, contributing to rebuilding those who have lost should not have a ceiling. I have fought against you H and enjoyed both success and defeat so if I am biased then I do not consider it to be largely one way or another but I will say this to your current opponents, re-read the terms as KP asks, if you believe they are harsh and think again. If these terms are not considered, refined and passed, then there is no hope of lasting peace in this game. H?, by viewing the attack/defense stats each day, are out on their legs, the GA will destroy them in not too many more months.

As for a mediator, I put up my hand if both sides are accepting of that. And as for rebuilding, we at Grey officially open our stores to aid anyone from any side in the rebuilding of their towns.
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Nokigon View Drop Down
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Points: 1452 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Nokigon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 09:31
Wow!

I have refrained from commenting in this thread and the ones akin to them before now, but by this point I have become so irritated that I feel obliged to speak out.

Firstly, addressing Dittobite and the overall Grand Alliance- please don't use the wearisome and boring argument about how Harmless should have helped the Dominion out of a tight spot over and over again.

Harmless were too far from the Dominion to be able to intervene effectively. In addition, many of our sieges were not on optimal terrain for cavalry (the only troops that COULD reach us) so hitting our sieges would have hurt everyone in the long run. Very very early on in the war, Kumomoto warned me that Harmless support would have been limited. NC, Dlords and Harmless supported our outlying members wherever possible, and they all supported us with resources freely and wherever needed. Besides that, Harmless couldn't have saved us from the enemy sieges. Saying that Harmless is in some way responsible for our surrender betrays ignorance, and possibly some way of trying to pass the blame for the loss of several cities.

As for how the terms are in some way an insult... KP has agreed to two of the original terms in your surrender treaty. His requests for the gold are not directed towards supplying his own alliance, but rather for the Dominion. Everyone appears to be interested in this Illy Code of Conduct- I myself am too, and whilst I can straight away see a few problems there are a few easily solutions to this. There doesn't however, seem much point in discussing them in more detail, because the Grand Alliance don't care about people having all of their cities razed.

DB are willing to provide cities from permasat accounts (we don't have many) to any Harmless players who have lost several cities in this war, priorities to players who have lost everything. At this point, I'm too hacked off to offer them to the Grand Alliance also.

I recall that a couple of years ago, Rill sent Harmless the compensation that they demanded from the Faenorians over some incident or another. (disclaimer- this is NOT about Rill- she has in fact commented very positively so far in this topic). I am extremely tempted to do the same- however, as peace reparations so far have cost my alliance nearly 10billion gold all in all, with our own terms and the assistance that we have given to our allies, I don't see the point of bankrupting myself even further when the Grand Alliance appear not to have any interest in a peace that does nothing other than satisfy their inflated egos.

Dittobite set a far higher standard for himself when he was negotiating peace between DB and the Grand Alliance, and this made me feel hopeful about future relations between us. For a moment, he had convinced that his reasons for fighting Harmless were true- that he was too worried about NC's actions to not intervene. If that were true, I feel certain that he would not have a problem with letting Harmless off lightly in the reparations, because they have been annihilated in the war. But no, he just wants to rub dirt in their face and to humiliate them.

Brilliant.
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Aurordan View Drop Down
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Points: 982 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aurordan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 10:21
If you read one of the several very public threads here Nokigon, you would see that the terms currently on offer call for a grand total of zero reparations, so you should reconsider some opinions there, I imagine.  

I should also clarify that nobody actually involved has called the terms an insult, I believe your referring to my comments.  While I would find such terms insulting, and would expect the Alliance do, I wouldn't actually know.  But I wouldn't try to force an agreement like the one proposed by KP, to commit to policing other people's behavior, on anyone for any reason, and to try to include it as part of your own surrender terms is extremely arrogant, to say the least. 
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Nokigon View Drop Down
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Points: 1452 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nokigon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 10:31
http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/an-open-letter-to-h-rank-and-file_topic5702.html

The terms included here refers to 2billion gold in reparations.
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lethargic0N3 View Drop Down
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No it doesn't
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Nokigon View Drop Down
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Points: 1452 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nokigon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 10:37
2 .  2 billion escrow NAP with NAAM

Am I the only person reading this?
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lethargic0N3 View Drop Down
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Points: 35 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lethargic0N3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 10:39
How is a escrow NAP repartations?
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Nokigon View Drop Down
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Points: 1452 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nokigon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 10:42
It involves the payment of gold. From the perspective of the paying alliance, they are the same thing.
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