Grandpa... tell us about the war |
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Angrim
Postmaster General Joined: 02 Nov 2011 Location: Laoshin Status: Offline Points: 1212 |
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it would be a shame to see this thread derailed because players cannot keep to the topic. there are about a hundred other forum topics in which the warring sides can accuse one another of misdeeds, misrepresentations and half-truths.
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KillerPoodle
Postmaster General Joined: 23 Feb 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1853 |
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Not sure why gossip and shadar are so set on dredging up the past but whatever.
I don't think so. Firstly because I do not recall ever saying anything of the sort (but I don't claim perfect recall so feel free to refresh my memory with some proof). Second, from the very beginning H? is one of the few alliances who truly understood that the moment you put your diplos and troops out there you are opening yourself up to a response regardless of how "right" you think you are. It doesn't mean you have to agree with the response, but it's always a possibility. This is something Consone and Jasche never "got".
And nope again. Jasche himself sent out an IGM on Oct 11th to VIC stating that any members were free to send troops to get involved in the RHY/ABSA war. He did this without any attempt to discuss diplomacy with RHY (FYI that makes him a worse diplomat than Sir Brad - who did send a message before sending troops). The only reason he later tried to recall that order was when he realised the size of what he'd stepped in. Had it been a smaller and less able alliance than H? he would have continued with his casual/thoughtless escalation and Consone would have rumbled onward. The fact that that kind of brainless escalation was hard coded into Consone's constitution enabled instant bullying of smaller alliances who tried to stand up to them, and is one of the reasons Consone was a ill executed idea from the start. FYI - I allowed Jasche to call my bluff in public because I did not want him to know how good our intel was, but the fact is, we knew he was the one who pulled the trigger to send VIC troops into battle and that his only reason to recant was because he was scared of H? rather than some higher peaceful ambition. |
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"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM
"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
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Daefis
Wordsmith Joined: 05 Aug 2011 Location: London Status: Offline Points: 128 |
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KP you're being selective in your memories again I'm afraid. Jasche's mail was very clear that the only action was to clear sieges nothing more and you know this. Unfortunately it had become apparent even at this point that it was a set up by H? to instigate a war as HM has now been good to confirm to everyone in another thread.
Jasche made attempts at diplomacy with H? and was consistently rebuffed, patronised or simply ignored for his efforts. H? engineered the situation and Jasche had no way of dufusing a situation that was already scripted and in progress.
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KillerPoodle
Postmaster General Joined: 23 Feb 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1853 |
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You're still missing both points.
Sending troops to get a new alliance involved in a war is an escalation, regardless of what those troops are going to do. Had it been a smaller and less scary alliance there would have been no attempts at diplomacy. Jasche's attempts were too little, too late and for the wrong reasons. |
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"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM
"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill |
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Daefis
Wordsmith Joined: 05 Aug 2011 Location: London Status: Offline Points: 128 |
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And futile since you had already geared up for war and were going to have it regardless. Anyway this is rehashing old news but belittling Jasche over a year after he was driven out of the game isn't very becoming. |
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Gossip Boy
Forum Warrior Joined: 03 Oct 2011 Status: Offline Points: 259 |
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Because maybe your leader started slandering jasche in another thread. Just another example of your hypocrisy. |
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Elessar2
[08:34]<Rill> when you've just had part of your brain taken out, you lack a certain amount of credibility <KillerPoodle> I can say anything I like and it is impossible to prove or disprove |
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Hora
Postmaster Joined: 10 May 2010 Status: Offline Points: 839 |
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About derailing the thread...
It was me and HM to bring up the topic of Consone war - non derail at all, as the Consone war is a important part within this history lesson. We both stated multiple times, that each thread was a BIASED version of the same story, and we were both trying to add to the understanding of each other without the vicious pre- and postwar propaganda rhethorics. Would like to have seen a thread with many posts like this, but certain persons dragged it back to finding culprits and insulting people, trying to invent other peoples motivations out of some (again BIASED) intell they might have got. I made my point in here, so did HM. Many nice people also defended the names insulted, and I think they made their point, too (Many thanks for that!). So my advice is to ignore any further accusations in here, as I hope they tend to fall back to the wielder. This said, I'll retreat myself from this topic - actually to follow HM's example. kindest regards.
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Nokigon
Postmaster General Player Council - Historian Joined: 07 Nov 2010 Status: Offline Points: 1452 |
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http://cdn9.illyriad.com/filter?url=http://www.illyriad.co.uk/Content/player/uk1/Illyriad_x379_y91_z5_2014-01-18T13-49-139e26d510-3b2a-4af0-aad3-032748435e67.jpg
I used to have more but I cleared everything on my laptop recently and this is the only screenshot I still have. This is a nice representation of an average DB siege.
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Deranzin
Postmaster Joined: 10 Oct 2011 Status: Offline Points: 845 |
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Well now that I have an interesting tale to share, I might as well record it ... let us name it :
One+ alliance vs one player Anyone looking at the war map will notice how good and obvious target I am atm ... anticipating such an eventuality I had all my cities surrounded by plains, but against overwhelming odds that doesn't really mean anything in the end, other than some good k/d ratios ... so it was not long since an operation was organized by the the nearby powerhouse of VICX to attack two of my cities at the same time. Of course, before that, they thoroughly scouted my cities and after analyzing the data they decided to attack the cities of 3. Xarvanthor and 8. Lar Toribar, which contained 24K pikemen and almost 8K knights respectively, with THREE sieges for each city. Their general plan was like that as it unfolded :
So let us take the faster tale first : Lar Toribar The sieges contained a lot of siege weapons and were well protected and myzel's siege contained 42K pikemen within it so the situation was dire indeed ... I prestige builded the city a bit to move the raze moment to a more convenient time for my RL schedule and then left the town to de-level while only killing blockades. In this case I miscalculated and wasted my knights on the totally wrong siege, so the city was empty of troops as well, not that knights were any good in defending, but anyway ... so, I thought of something else ... since I was the one actually timing the moment the city would hit the raze population, I sent some pikemen on my own inside the city in the hope that they would hit the raze button immediately. So, in went 50K pikemen, awaiting Myzel's hit ... but it never came ... they saw the armies coming and wisely kept their hands away from the "storm and raze" button So after two hours, in lew of another incoming attack, I withdrew my pikemen to be used for later battles and proclaimed the city lost. But that didn't happen as soon as I thought either ... because VICX saw my armies go in, but they didn't seem to notice them going out or they didn't believe that all of them where out ... so when that incoming turned out to be a blockade they were left with a town with unknown defenders and since I had killed my knights early on, they had been sending only blockades ... so they had to wait for many hours (around 10) for Myzel to send another attack to confirm that the city was indeed empty and then hit the raze button. And thus Lar Toribar fell, but not without quite some fun involved as you just read. Now the other, longer, tale for the "happy end" : Xarvanthor
The reason for this was my belief that I could dodge with my armies at any time of the day (I am usually around the computer) and at night I could get a sitter to help me with that task and the existence of an army inside the city would deter them for a longer time if they were bereft of the siege that had troops, than losing the siege without troops ... So, down siege three went, to a significant cost of my forces, but it was worth it ... because now they were left with two sieges that couldn't storm the city so we entered the dodge-dance while I kept most blockades down (more for fun, than to ship resources since I wasn't building anything anymore at that moment) and the city went to zero population and stayed there for many many many hours ... and the sieges were ticking away, because thinking of the whole matter as a normal 3 siege procedure they correctly assumed that 2-3 days would be more than enough to flatten the city ... and the city was flat indeed ... flatter than a pancake pressed by a bulldozer ... but it still had 24000 pikemen in it Somewhere in these hours of zero population, Geofrey (who was owner of the 1 million + protected siege) must have thought that he could make the raze call between my dodges (or so I think. I do not really believe that he accidentally hit the button, though that can happen as well) so he tried this out in the premise of "we have another active siege anyway and the town is zero pop as well, so any more bombardment is useless" ... and WHAM he landed on my spearmen and siege one was down Unbeknownst to me my neighbor Keaves[BANE] after sending a couple of hits and blockades, was sending a siege of his own, a fourth siege (which now resides in my signature) containing this time ONLY troops (15000 knights in particular) and also provided occupying forces on another square along with Rathgore[vCrow] (another neighbor) ... So, what I thought was a direct hit, I was amazed (and, sorry VICX, also hugely amuzed ) to find it was another siege ... they had asked literally for the cavalry to arrive and with their siege have 1d and half left, they had asked for other allies to chip in and make things even more harder for me ... Well I was flattered, but my city was also flattened at the same time ... I considered destroying Keave's siege before too many occupationaly forces reinforced it, but it would be futile as I knew that he had another cavalry city nearby ... I thought that I could keep dodging till the time Keave's siege activates and hope he'd be offline (he had timed it only for 15h, so he had only 3h to hit raze) or that somehow I could reinforce the city right at that moment with the forces I saved from Lar Toribar ... now THAT would have worked, but it would need THE timing and uber careful planning ... but it was a surefire victory if I could pull it off ... So I set to planning that arduous task and then it hit me ! ... or actually something ELSE hit the last siege ... it was a messenger recalling one of their armies within ... I scouted the square and it turned out that the most massive force defending it had just GONE and now I could take it out even with my leftover forces ! So, why hit Keaves and his rising occupation force .?. It was no longer relevant in my plans ... now I could take out siege 2 which I had left alone and so noone else though of reinforcing further and then drop as many blockades as possible and sneak in one caravan ... so, with the catapults gone, if I build up to ANY amount of population Keaves and his forces would be unable to storm my hut (it was no longer a city ) I scrambled to send scouts to the blockades, do the calculations and lo and behold reserving troops instead of just whacking them on their massive forces paid off ... I had the forces needed ! In fact I could have taken it down even without that recall, but it would have been a close shot and I might not have thought of it had I not seen that messenger going in and making my life easier.
VICTORY !!! and the One+ Alliance Vs one player tale, ended with the score 1-1 ... for now ... I expect this to be my last victory of that kind (I most certainly not have the troops for another feat like that, nor will they make the same overconfident mistakes that made everything actually possible), but that is indeed a good way to go down ... by having fun at it So, last but not least, as I said in GC yesterday, a big thank you to VICX el al for providing the excitement and the thrill of making me do all those close calls and quick decisions and a big thank you to my alliance who help me implement my plans by keeping my troops alive while I slept. Edited by Deranzin - 28 Feb 2014 at 09:41 |
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Just like a "before and after" ad ! ahahahaah :p |
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Mr Damage
Postmaster Joined: 01 Jan 2011 Status: Offline Points: 598 |
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Fantastic reading Deranzin, well done.
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