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Starry 
Postmaster
Joined: 20 Mar 2010
Location: California
Status: Offline
Points: 612
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 Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 04:12 |
Actually that is exactly what you said:
 The fact that EE wanted to fight H? doesn't exclude H? from wanting to fight EE. And based on the fact that H? declared, I would say they probably intend/want to fight EE. |
And no, alliances don't necessarily WANT to go to war, circumstances sometimes demand they do so. To say that all wars are consenting is naive at best, alliance declare war and attack alliances, parties do not have to consent which is exactly what is happening to NC.
Of course, I do remember a time in Illy when so many alliances piling on one small alliance was considered bullying, apparently, integrity and fair play have gone from the game.
Edit: And...alliances leaders who give their word lack the integrity to keep it.
Edited by Starry - 29 Oct 2013 at 04:14
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CEO, Harmless?
Founder of Toothless?
"Truth never dies."
-HonoredMule
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Vanerin
Forum Warrior
Joined: 05 Oct 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 418
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 04:37 |
Hmm, I think we are talking past each other. When I said " based on the fact that H? declared, I would say they probably intend/want to fight EE." I did not mean it as "intended/wanted." Actually that is what I wrote at first, but once I read the post I realized my mistake and edited to the present tense to avoid confusion. Unfortunately that didn't work out as well as planned...
As for assuming, I never said "that all wars are consenting."* I just pointed out that this one appears to be and wonder what all of the hullabaloo is about. Why are both side so fervently trying to spin this when they both are ok with it happening? This question probably doesn't have a good answer, but I can't help but ponder it.
~Vanerin
*I admit I am assuming you are talking about me in that statement. Please correct me if I am wrong.
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Nokigon
Postmaster General
Player Council - Historian
Joined: 07 Nov 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 1452
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 08:30 |
So apparently everyone decided to overlook my direct quote from Hath, where he clearly stated that he wanted war.
Geofrey- TVM was a member of the last war.
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Darmon
Forum Warrior
Joined: 15 Aug 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 315
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 08:52 |
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Why are you all saying that EE wanted a war with H? if they only declared on TVM?
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Deranzin
Postmaster
Joined: 10 Oct 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 845
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 09:33 |
Hora wrote:
Especially those RL examples are crap: in RL people DIE, in Illy they don't!! (Thanks Luna for preventing those!) |
Which is imho all the more reason to not insult logic and real life, by sophistries for the sake of a game. And Luna prevented current politics, not ancient ones. How fortunate that the past is much broader than the present, eh .?. 
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Gnorfum
New Poster
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 30
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 10:58 |
Starry wrote:
<span style=": rgb251, 244, 225; line-height: 1.4;">Of course, I do remember a time in Illy when so many alliances piling on one small alliance was considered bullying, apparently, integrity and fair play have gone from the game. </span>
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Of course, I remember a time when H? would not back up alliances like NC no matter what they do. I also remember situations where mighty H? was threatening and fighting small alliances or single players that did not behave according to what H? considered to be 'fair play'. This 'fair play' can be defined very differently. For many players I belive NC does not look like an alliance that treats them 'fair'. And H?, TCol and others apparently backing up NC whenever they get themselves into trouble does not appear to be 'fair' for those alliances that are under attack by NC. What NC was doing is not a 'fair' fight. And also the cancelation of a peace treaty as is happening now and here is obviously not considered 'fair' from many players. I suggest H? to use this word more carefull when reffering to the entire game. Fairness is something very subjective.
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Learn how to play Illy and live in freedome: TOR-U
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Starry
Postmaster
Joined: 20 Mar 2010
Location: California
Status: Offline
Points: 612
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 12:39 |
This appears to be revisionist history, in the early days H was the one who stood up to White, and H took the lead on protecting new players. Give one example where H dictated how any alliance ran their alliance unless they were preying on new players?
Then tell me how this is fair by any stretch of the imagination:
|
Members |
Pop |
| NC |
20 |
2,007,473 |
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| NAAM |
35 |
2,897,637 |
| uCrow |
33 |
2,443,199 |
| CK (XckX) |
80 |
3,142,108 |
| DARK |
80 |
6,626,970 |
| EE |
81 |
6,323,921 |
| ALT |
51 |
1,284,219 |
| Totals |
360 |
22,718,054 |
I believe you should look up the definition of a bully. Play all the games you want but HATH's post made it very clear what is going on here, maybe you buy the "NC is a bully" propaganda but I advise you to step back and review the facts or you can continue to drink the koolaid that Hath has offered.
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CEO, Harmless?
Founder of Toothless?
"Truth never dies."
-HonoredMule
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KillerPoodle
Postmaster General
Joined: 23 Feb 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 1853
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 12:48 |
Darmon wrote:
Why are you all saying that EE wanted a war with H? if they only declared on TVM? |
As stated above Hath said they would declare on one alliance to get "the rest of the coalition" involved.
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"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM
"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill
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ES2
Postmaster
Joined: 25 Sep 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 550
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 13:35 |
| Starry
Then tell me how this is fair by any stretch of the imagination:
|
Members |
Pop |
| NC |
20 |
2,007,473 |
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| NAAM |
35 |
2,897,637 |
| uCrow |
33 |
2,443,199 |
| CK (XckX) |
80 |
3,142,108 |
| DARK |
80 |
6,626,970 |
| EE |
81 |
6,323,921 |
| ALT |
51 |
1,284,219 |
| Totals |
360 |
22,718,054 |
[/QUOTE wrote:
War is never fair, to request it to be would mean for it to become something of an exercise. A conflict with rules that would have combat proceed until a certain point. What is the value in engaging in a conflict but having to restrict yourself to be as close to a 1:1 as possible? Where is the value in allies, so they can cheer on the sidelines?
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War is never fair, to request it to be would mean for it to become something of an exercise. A conflict with rules that would have combat proceed until a certain point. What is the value in engaging in a conflict but having to restrict yourself to be as close to a 1:1 as possible? Where is the value in allies, so they can cheer on the sidelines?
Edited by ES2 - 29 Oct 2013 at 13:36
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Eternal Fire
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Elmindra
Forum Warrior
Joined: 10 Sep 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 464
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Posted: 29 Oct 2013 at 13:39 |
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Um, EE never declared on NC so take us off that list.
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