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Topic ClosedAutomated intercity caravans

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nvp33 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2011 at 00:32
Actually the idea of making Tradeagreements, like send me 10k iron/day would be great Nesse, could be used for tons of things, and wouldn't be truly possible without an automated system of some kind at least. Could also be used for setting up internal supply routes for "red" cities.
Good really good possibbillities this, really good...
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Nesse View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 20:08
I'd love to have a couple of automated supply routes going out. I would have to renegotiate trade agreements for it, but that is fun. .)
How about having a limited number of automated routes without prestige, and more with prestige? Even one outgoing would reduce repetition a lot, and having two on prestige would make sense.
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Ander View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 17:43
One idea for a "Trade overseer" could be something like a unit with these kind of options-

-----------------------------------------------------
Overseer Commands
<   Current City   >   [wood] [clay]...[siege blocks]
<Destination City>   [wood] [clay]...[siege blocks]
-----------------------------------------------------

The trader unit would travel back and forth between city 1 and city 2 with the selected resources and the caravans required. If the mentioned resources are not available in a city, he would wait there till they become available and set off again. The trade movements will continue until they are cancelled.

Such a complex mechanism might be an overkill just to keep supplying towns with resources. A lot of players wouldn't be interested in an expensive "Trade Overseer" just for shuttling food and iron. 

If trade becomes something more than what it currently is, the arrangements could add some value. Say you need raw materials from two different factions to craft something in your capital and sell it to another faction in need. A few carefully made trade arrangements with the local factions could save a lot of 'work'. This would also justify a high  upkeep for a trade overseer unit.



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Also the use of additional caravans for trade outside the player's cities may be restricted. ie the trader would be allowed to carry only 1000 resources or so for any arrangements outside his own cities. This could avoid a few problems like -
1. alliance members setting automated trades to new players, thereby killing their gameplay in 2 weeks.
2. Alt accounts routinely sending resources to the main account and vice versa. 
3. A player sending resources to alliance mates while going on a vacation.

Also, a trade arrangement need not involve more than two cities. More cities will make the "orders" page cluttered without any significant addition to functionality. 
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nvp33 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 14:29
The idea isn't to make prestige spenders even more powerful. The ide is to take a mundane repetetive task, which, if let to it self, can result in major loss of resources and troopsand uatomate it. Someone said "well just make balanced cities" but that's not possible for all of us aftet the big move 6 months back, and for other ppl it's just not plausible for their playstyle to make these "balanced" cities.

It might not need to be a prestige spending option, but in my opinion there's need for a look at sending resources around between a players own cities. It could also be done with a "shared pool" of food and/or gold, but that would be a bit overkill in my opinion. Automated caravans for an intercity commerce traderoute would seem to be the way to go. But if there are other ideas, other than "don't build that way then", then let's hear them, I'm all ears :-)
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Kilotov of DokGthung View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 14:01
leave prestige as it is...its enough 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 12:16
I'd vote against Prestige here. If something special needs automating, then it should be kept simple by using units, research or buildings.

For example, we currently have a Messenger unit, which runs out to deliver orders to armies. It is a very temporary and expendable unit, for occasional use. I propose something similar here: a unit or mode of operation that can be temporarily employed to automate the supply task. It should have a high cost and expire (or need refreshing) after some time, like the Messenger.

So my proposal is a 'Trade Commander' unit that (is trained and when deployed) can be given limited orders to travel to-and-fro a few times with the caravans. This should fit nicely with what I've heard of current dev roadmap, and lots of possibilities exist to duplicate the Military army+division+commander+units model into Trade, so we'd have the Trade Commander carrying extra abilities to help make travel and trade more successful.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 12:00
Originally posted by liberty6 liberty6 wrote:

Originally posted by The Duke The Duke wrote:

Not only do they want to avoid automation but they have said repeatedly that they don't want prestige accounts to hold an overbearing amount of advantage over other non-prestige players. Also as stated previously- if you keep your cities stable instead of exploiting the negative food and negative gold then this isn't a problem. Specialize your cities so they don't go in the negative- and then your cities can all work together supplying w.e it is you need- not every city needs to be maxed out 
thank you for backing me up. now i have seen games where paying members have always had the advantage and would kill free players with it. illyriad has always been in my opinion maintained a semblance of equality for free and paying players. not only by allowing free players to have a some what equal base it keeps them in but it might get them to suggest it to a friend. and i have seen paying members get bored because they built so quick they have nothing else to do.
Equally though you don't have to be a paying player to have an active prestige account; you just need to be an active player claiming their daily gift - so I don' really think having an active prestige account is an arguement about free vs paying.


Edited by surferdude - 17 Aug 2011 at 12:01
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Shuey707 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 08:46
In all honesty, I don't see how this could be used to give an upper hand to a player if designed correctly. Making it only usable to send to a player's own cities and limiting the amount of times per week it can be used would also lower the 'advantage' it gives. In actuality though, it just removes one needlessly mundane task from the game: Sending resources from one city to another on a schedule.

Whether it's supplying food or gold to a 'red' city, or sending resources to that new town you just settled, you're eliminating one repetitive task to allow yourself to get back to the fun of the game. Too much automation is just as bad as none at all.

Most sane people grow bored of doing repetitive tasks, causing them to grow bored of Illyriad and leaving. Also, as nvp33 stated, if you log in one day and realize that your military is gone because you forgot to send gold out the day before, it could cause you to give in and quit. Losing players is usually a bad thing.


Edited by Shuey707 - 17 Aug 2011 at 08:47
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GM Stormcrow View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 03:41
Very interesting discussion - please continue it!

It's definitely something we've spent quite some time on internally, and there are good arguments on either side (both for and against automated vans of some description, and also for or against making it prestigable).

There are some content releases upcoming that might alleviate some of these issues, but there are also some other content releases upcoming that might accentuate some of these issues as well, so it's something of a "hot topic" atm internally.

Generally we use extreme caution around prestigable options, and we also apply extreme caution to automation. Equally we understand that grinding repetitive functions simply isn't quite as much fun as it really should be ;)

I'd really like this discussion to continue, though - I think the broader the input the more likely we are to come to a sensible conclusion.

Regards,

SC


Edited by GM Stormcrow - 17 Aug 2011 at 03:41
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liberty6 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2011 at 02:49
Originally posted by The Duke The Duke wrote:

Not only do they want to avoid automation but they have said repeatedly that they don't want prestige accounts to hold an overbearing amount of advantage over other non-prestige players. Also as stated previously- if you keep your cities stable instead of exploiting the negative food and negative gold then this isn't a problem. Specialize your cities so they don't go in the negative- and then your cities can all work together supplying w.e it is you need- not every city needs to be maxed out 
thank you for backing me up. now i have seen games where paying members have always had the advantage and would kill free players with it. illyriad has always been in my opinion maintained a semblance of equality for free and paying players. not only by allowing free players to have a some what equal base it keeps them in but it might get them to suggest it to a friend. and i have seen paying members get bored because they built so quick they have nothing else to do.
whats happened to the world? if intelegent life came to earth is RL would they consider us intelligent or not? probably not!!!!
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