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An Open letter to H? rank and file
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Brandmeister View Drop Down
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Points: 2396 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brandmeister Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 15:50
I know the idea of a Illy U.N. is meant sincerely, but I'm chilled by the idea. Some of us play this game to escape modern real life, not recreate it in meticulous detail. Trying to enforce peace in a game about warlords and kingdoms strikes me as somewhat clueless. What, then, is the point of Illyriad? I'm not saying that everything that has happened in this war was in a spirit of good sportsmanship or good taste, but I think parallels to real world politics and morality are completely misplaced.

Imaginary worlds are places where it's okay to act outside of commonly accepted social norms. You can play the Vikings in Illyriad, and that's largely acceptable. However, I would note that these forums exist in the real world, not within the game, and it appears several of you have lost sight of that. What you say here, is said between real people. To a certain extent, GC is like that as well. The animosity displayed is unhealthy, given that this is simply a video game, made and sold for entertainment. Some of you are holding on to Illyriad way too tightly.
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Thexion View Drop Down
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Points: 258 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thexion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 16:04
No worries regardless how this war ends or if it ever ends there be other wars sooner or later and game goes on. I know it is disturbing to read about wars and destroyed accounts but this is how the game is a "sandbox" you can do what you think is right and harmless is doing so.
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dantem View Drop Down
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I still think that nvp's idea is perfect for this situation, but not in the long run. As it is there is enough of that with regards to big players dictating terms to smaller ones. If a newbie is attacked and their alliance is unable to help there is always someone in GC who will help...here i think the newbies have it much easier than larger players and once you become big, it is upto you to take care of yourself. 

Ofcourse mistakes happen, but it is usually sorted out quick and easy. The proposal for 3 players as a council for this war is a very good idea and I still stick by the fact that it should be a still new player who can listen to facts from both sides without having a pre determined opinion.

Yes I know there are vets who start a newbie account, but I am sure most people know who they are and another thing I would recommend is someone who is active in GC, because if they were a vet pretending to be a newbie, GC usually catches up to them.

So I recommend that H? choose someone and GA choose someone and the two chosen will decide the tie breaker player. This is what you suggested right nvp?

And an immediate stop to hostilities during this discussion.

Any takers? KillerPoodle?? Hath??

Cheers,

P.s 1 spot left in the chocolate tester role, after which only white chocolate peasants will be entertained Tongue
I believe that if life gives you lemons, you should make lemonade... And try to find somebody whose life has given them vodka, and have a party.
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Brids17 View Drop Down
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Points: 1483 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brids17 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 17:11
Originally posted by KillerPoodle KillerPoodle wrote:

There's no pleasing some people - we do not control the entire server, nor do we tell our allies what to do.

So....wait, you had no problem with your allies siege'ing people down to nothing but when your enemies do it, suddenly it's bad for the game? Way to be concise... 
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KillerPoodle View Drop Down
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Points: 1853 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KillerPoodle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 17:21
Way to miss the point - as I mentioned - Goon were not even an ally - Faya sent us one message saying "we think you're right and want to be on your side - FYI we're attack Gigi" and we replied with -"please don't siege this guy out of the game".

What else do you think we should have done?  Also, you realize your current alliance was involved in that op with Faya too, right?  Do you blame them too?

As I said, no reason, just bile from you (as per usual).
"This is a bad idea and we shouldn't do it." - endorsement by HM

"a little name-calling is a positive thing." - Rill
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nvp33 View Drop Down
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@ Brandmeister - I'm in no way trying to replecate RL in meticulous detail. But with regards to war, its consequences and how seriously take loosing cities due to the incredible amount of time and even money spent on building it up, there are similarities with regards to politics, relations between "powers" and how they act.

Setting up a convention on the rules of war, and having a specific method or even council to arbitrate a fair peace for all involved, is not a bad idea. It could prevent people from leaving the game over a bunch of misunderstandings which lead to a war which spirraled out of control with noone or nothing to guide their actions, nor stop the war to spiral out of control.

I'm not suggesting a UN og Illyriad, I am however suggesting a convention on the rules of war, enforced by self interest, and by others having an interest in others not breaking them.

As a person who had two alliances under the threat of extinction a year and a half ago, and where the war spun out of control in the opposite direction and people were sieged out of the game, I know first hand why it is needed.

Sincerely Nvp

A curiously wellspoken orc
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geofrey View Drop Down
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Originally posted by SunStorm SunStorm wrote:

Geofrey and Dantem:  Wonderfully thought out and articulated posts.  Thank you.

Although I have no stake in this fight, I sadly cannot refrain from voicing my own opinions on matters such as these.  So scroll down if you only want to read H? or GA posts.  :P  My feelings won't be hurt.

Originally posted by geofrey geofrey wrote:

. . . dignity, freedom, and honor. They are social concepts that only exist in a social settings. Part of those concepts are that you exclude certain people from your ideals. As in you are honorable because other people are not, etc.
Though there is something (and I'm not quite sure what) that makes me believe things are not this black and white, I will accept this premise as true and would be interested in how this might apply to the GA?  They also uphold their dignity, freedom, and honor.  They believe themselves to be more honorable than Harmless, and to prove this point, they will siege Harmless out of the game.  This kinda reminds me of a fable about a girl named Snow White and a stepmother who needed to prove she was the most beautiful...  Please don't misunderstand, because this leads me into the next points I would like to make.

To avoid any confusion, please note this is only my opinion as a member of an alliance. 

Yes. The same thing applies to the Grand Alliance. I am not saying that it is wrong to have a sense of honor. 

The primary difference is that we do not want to completely annihilate another alliance solely because that other alliance's sense of honor and dignity doesn't align with ours. However, we also don't want to get wiped out by another alliance. And sense the other alliance refuses to lay down their arms against us, are are left with no choice but to either quarantine, which is very difficult to do in this game if not impossible, or to eliminate all military presence. 

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Brandmeister View Drop Down
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Points: 2396 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brandmeister Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 18:59
@nvp:

What you're describing would turn Illyriad into some kind of tournament system, where major city destruction isn't a possibility. I think that horse has left the barn. There has been account annihilation in this war, and for better or worse, that's part of the Illyriad culture now. Obviously some have argued that annihilation has been part of prior wars as well, and this one simply had more of it.

It's the word "seriously" that draws my criticism. I've played Illyriad for 1.5 years, but it's still a video game. Yes, it's possible to spend money on this game, but if a player cannot bear the possibility of losing that tiny investment, I'd sincerely recommend not making it. Likewise with time. It's a game of kingdoms and armies, it has an element of risk. While you might wish to change the perceived level of risk, I'd question if that's possible in a sandbox game, even by mutual agreement. I have a sense that even if everyone agreed, such an accord would still be unenforceable against confederations of any meaningful size. I'd argue against further removing risks from a game, as it already has zero risk or consequences relative to the real world.

Edited by Brandmeister - 01 Jul 2014 at 19:00
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DeliciousJosh View Drop Down
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Points: 417 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeliciousJosh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2014 at 20:50
can we lock this now?

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Albatross View Drop Down
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Points: 1118 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Albatross Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2014 at 01:30
Copy a little text from here. Paste in into http://www.acapela-group.com/ with English (UK) and Rosie selected. Then listen to what you have written.
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