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A New Approach To Peace, Version 2.0
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Velociryx View Drop Down
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Points: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Velociryx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jul 2014 at 19:08
The GA = The Grand Alliance.
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Glin View Drop Down
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Points: 127 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jul 2014 at 19:00
Ok, Whats GA?
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Points: 982 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aurordan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jul 2014 at 06:35
Originally posted by Albatross Albatross wrote:

Just throwing a bone in here... Settlement terms are more likely to work if they are not materialistic, but are instead behavioural, especially if hostilities broke out as a result of dispute. So rather than "You will pay X and lose X" (which seems like punishment), why not instead agree terms for future behaviour? As well as prohibitive terms, you could include enabling terms, such as time-limited trade/supply agreements on contested resources. Get the idea?

Yes, because if there's one thing people love more than surrendering, it's surrendering and having indefinite constraints placed on their future behavior. /sarcasm

This would seem, at least to me, a lot more egregious than losing four cites and and an escrow, and then being able to go do whatever you want.  And it continues to not address the point that it isn't the specific terms it's a pride thing.  
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Points: 609 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bansisdead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jul 2014 at 06:16
Originally posted by abstractdream abstractdream wrote:

It's payback.


Exactly my thoughts, as you say the language coming from the GA certainly points to that.  Sadly the war won't stop until the alleged vengeance has been quenched.  Though the GA should bare in mind they could be next...
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abstractdream View Drop Down
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Points: 1857 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote abstractdream Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jul 2014 at 23:04
Originally posted by Nokigon Nokigon wrote:


The taking of the four cities is a symbol, a further kick in the guts for Harmless to remind them that this time, THEY lost. It's more of a statement from the GA than a lesson for Harmless.

Bullseye. If any of you read any of the threads about the current war, you may have noticed that every time a discussion came up about surrender terms, the posts from players on the side of the "GA" inevitably got back to the terms that H? imposed on them at the end of the Consone War. It's payback. It always has been. From the first armies launched in EE's war against TVM on through and up to whatever pound of flesh the new overlords will ultimately exact. Some of them have clearly stated it in this very forum. It's payback, plain and simple. Get used to it.
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Velociryx View Drop Down
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Points: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Velociryx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jul 2014 at 17:41
Right...I think the final shape of any conjectural agreement would be more of an agreement in principle rather than a tightly codified "code."

For instance - there's no rule outright prohibiting it (in fact, there's a mechanic that specifically allows for it), but we have, as a community, kind of adopted a code that says, "don't settle within ten tiles without permission."

We've also adopted the, "don't attack newbies" community rule, and "don't mess with training alliances" rule.

None of these are official RULES, and yet - the community at large seems quite content to abide by them.

(and in GC, we've adopted the "hug frequently" rule)



Edited by Velociryx - 18 Jul 2014 at 17:42
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Hora View Drop Down
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Points: 839 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Hora Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jul 2014 at 17:38
Originally posted by Albatross Albatross wrote:

Just throwing a bone in here... Settlement terms are more likely to work if they are not materialistic, but are instead behavioural, especially if hostilities broke out as a result of dispute. So rather than "You will pay X and lose X" (which seems like punishment), why not instead agree terms for future behaviour? As well as prohibitive terms, you could include enabling terms, such as time-limited trade/supply agreements on contested resources. Get the idea?

That is a cool idea, but how is the trade/supply agreement less punishment then "pay X"? I agree with the town capture stuff, this clearly is a punitive action.

Sadly, those behavioural agreememts would be much harder to negotiate than the simple "pay X" terms. And the e.g. mining dispute (don't know how I thought about that example Tongue) is never the reason! 
It simply is the cause to start the war, the reason in a game always is a mixture of "I'm bored!", and "I don't like your face...". 
E.g. the Consone war wouldn't have ended with the one alliance (ahh, who was involved in it... was it RHY?) to have the right for mining the one small Trove mine somewhere in nowhere Wink.

Often, the original dispute is long solved, after 1 month or so, while the big alliances fight along.
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DeliciousJosh View Drop Down
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Oblivious.

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Albatross View Drop Down
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Points: 1118 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Albatross Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jul 2014 at 13:25
Just throwing a bone in here... Settlement terms are more likely to work if they are not materialistic, but are instead behavioural, especially if hostilities broke out as a result of dispute. So rather than "You will pay X and lose X" (which seems like punishment), why not instead agree terms for future behaviour? As well as prohibitive terms, you could include enabling terms, such as time-limited trade/supply agreements on contested resources. Get the idea?
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Hora View Drop Down
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Points: 839 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hora Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jul 2014 at 13:14
...just nope... ehm ... NO,... I mean: Don't you get it?! ... Wacko

... This was a kind reminder, that such comparisons are definitly not appropriate, are not amusing, are totally away from the point, might irritate / confuse / deeply insult people in here.

I won't discuss it any further, but for future reference my kindest advice is to refrain from such comparisons, if you don't want to completly destroy your line of (possibly) valid points and have big parts of the forums seeing you as a troll... 


Edited by Hora - 18 Jul 2014 at 13:16
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