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TVM - SHARK Conflict

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Solanar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Solanar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 20:59
Copied from Illy Times 
Quote Odoacer

Some corrections:
1. The PvP was proposed by Lorcan to decide whether my cities remain in Newlands. I refused that outcome, so we decided to play for fun.
2. However, once he placed a siege (without a blockade, so I continued to build the city up between bombardments to its original population), he then sent an IGM offering to save the city if I moved another from their claim. At this point, I ended the PvP.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tacardi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 20:59
Agreed Auraya, But obviously SHARK seems to have different intentions. As indicated with troop filled cities landing in TVM land claim.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mrmarcdee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 22:32
Why do people assume things so resolutely when they do not know?
Why do you say "obvious" when there are alternative explanations?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Legoman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 03:14
Originally posted by Stukahh Stukahh wrote:

TVM is a tiny alliance.  

I am more concerned with Shark's aggression.  

Shark is 8 times the size of TVM.  I admire them for standing up for what they believe is right.  They must have a valid reason to do so.  Sometimes you just have to fight even though the odds are stacked against you.  

So people shouldn't support TVM because you are requesting they don't?  How about we lay the facts out on the table and let people think for themselves?

I don't think the community should be told what to do.  If you want to make this a public conversation we would be happy to hear both sides of the argument.

Stukahh

Isn't a land claim telling the community what to do, I.E stay out of my sandbox, even thou Illy is a sandbox for all players?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Angrim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 04:06
Originally posted by Solanar Solanar wrote:

However, to be fair, Halcyon said long ago (Posted: 05 Jul 2015 at 06:55) 
Quote 10 alliances, most of them very small, have claimed about 15 percent of Broken Lands (that's what my eyes are telling me when looking at Jejune's map). This means that a relatively small part of the players are trying to dictate to the majority where to place their cities.
i suppose that was mean to sound like an avaricious claim. is there a land claim size SHARK would have accepted? i think not, which makes this comment rather beside the point. it's not the size of the claim that's being invalidated, it's the procedure used to make it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JodaMyth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 16:37
    I don't understand the major issue here. Each side has a clear stance on land claims and are following through on it. TVM claimed an area and SHARK decided not to recognize land claims. It's up to TVM to defend their claim in this case either through diplomacy or military actions. There is a large size difference between the two but TVMs cluster and military focus would help negate much of that if it came down to an actual war.

       The thing between Odo and Lorcan seems to be a misunderstanding on the outcome and rules set up before the PvP took place, the only reason that was brought to a further light was through a combination of GC trolling, whining and soapboxing by some players painting SHARK as the enemy of all in an attempt to rally players/alliances against them hoping to hop into a war that has SHARK as the aggressors in order to avoid a pile on of Elgean confeds, at least that is how it seems to me. Ermm

This all could have been settled more easily but hindsight is 20/20 in this case it seems. 

Hey look a star! Star 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abstractdream Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 17:14
Originally posted by JodaMyth JodaMyth wrote:

This all could have been settled more easily but hindsight is 20/20 in this case it seems
It could have if TVM were to ignore the incursions or if the SHARK family were to move out. Clearly, neither are interested in those options.
Bonfyr Verboo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jejune Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 17:15
Originally posted by JodaMyth JodaMyth wrote:

    I don't understand the major issue here.

Yeah, me neither. Why would anyone lament this? This is the game. TVM made a big move to establish a bold land claim in the most central location in the BL. Shark also obviously wants to control part of that real estate, and were not going to let TVM annex it for themselves. This is in every sense of the word the makings of a "strategic" war for control of the southern half of Newlands.

It's not a conflict because someone trolled GC, insulted someone in the forum, or doesn't like someone else's face. If the conflict cannot be resolved diplomatically, then there will be a war. If TVM wins, they could potentially move Shark out of their land claim. If Shark wins, they could force TVM to drop the claim and relinquish control of their portion of Newlands. The stakes are high and reasons for the conflict are geographical/political, not personal.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zenorra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 20:03
Shark has been moving cities to BL for months. TVM have tried to solve things diplomatically, but Shark refuses to negotiate.

Lorcan and Odoacer agreed to a pvp. If Lorcan wins, Odoacer would have to move his city out of the land claim. If Odoacer looses, Odoacer would stay. Lorcan dropped his TVM tag for this pvp, to keep TVM out of it. I have PROOF of this agreement. I would post it here, but I've been told its against the TOS.

When Lorcan launched a siege against Odoacer during their pvp, Shark sent a mail telling Lorcan to remove the siege or they would remove it for him. (paraphrasing here). Lorcan recalled most of his armies, but did end up losing 1 to Shark. Next, Shark armies were/are on the way to various TVM members (some have been feints so far).

Here is a screenshot with the TVM LC overlay.

"Why is this an issue?" I see this question asked several times already in this thread. This is an issue because Shark decided to pick on TVM first. Out of all of the different land claim alliances out there they could have chosen, they chose the one that is in a well known confederation. Shark is goading the DSD into another war. If and when the rest of the DSD steps in to support TVM, Sharks will bring their friends and BOOM! Another server war. THATS why this is an issue.


Edited by Zenorra - 15 Sep 2015 at 20:05
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JodaMyth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 20:31
Originally posted by Zenorra Zenorra wrote:

"Why is this an issue?" I see this question asked several times already in this thread. This is an issue because Shark decided to pick on TVM first. Out of all of the different land claim alliances out there they could have chosen, they chose the one that is in a well known confederation. Shark is goading the DSD into another war. If and when the rest of the DSD steps in to support TVM, Sharks will bring their friends and BOOM! Another server war. THATS why this is an issue.
 
A server war would not be a good way to describe it, more like half a server war since if the entire DSD gets involved probably 80% of the fighting will be in Elgea judging by city locations. There would still be a large number of alliance uninvolved.  The mix of a LC and confed here only serve to burden one side of a confed without adding any benefit to it, in the sense of needing to defend the claim itself not TVM as an alliance. As it stands it's a matter of alliance vs alliance which is slowly (or rapidly in Illy terms) devolving into confed vs confed. 

If both sides want a peaceful solution maybe try the same deal you have with mCrow in that claim. Seeing the previous server war mentioned though suggests to me there is some old bitterness still left over on either side. I wasn't around for that so sadly I cannot comment on it.  

Now that I read up I shouldn't be commenting on any of this as it's got nothing to do with me or my alliance Big smile

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