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HonoredMule View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 06:09
I'm sorry but I'm just not reading all that.  I don't feel any need to rebut the first few paragraphs save a factual clarification, and I'm not going any further.  I shall note that you disagree, and do so with grandiose self-righteous rhetoric, stuffing more words in our mouths that ever first emerged.

The minor points of correction:  "We knew we could better compete on production and heavy-hitting than deployment."  We are talking about military production required to replace troops lost hitting the bigger parties rather than endless spamming on smaller ones.  Diplomat production has nothing to do with it.

Yes, NPC farming is tedious and boring to us.  And no, we're not leaving over it--this game is for us, as it is one of the few which truly tries to avoid the tedium associated with typical browser-based games.  I would not have you misleading new players into thinking they can expect a farming grind.  Patience, yes.  Grind, no.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 08:54
I also gave up reading that post after a few paragraphs and a scroll down to find the end. It is echoing the the tournament by a lengthy grind of the proverbial axe.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 12:47
Hi there all,
 
I'd just like to assure you I do have something to say about this, yet I will write my post later, possibly after the tournament, as the discussion will possibly take much time and I'm in the middle of a crunchtime to preBeta milestone of my last game. I will limit my time in Illyriad to quickly sending out armies rather than spending long hours on sending flocks of birds (which takes incomparably more time then hunting - but then, as HM said, Victors work smarter, not harder) then.
 
The only purpose of this short post now is to avoid the feeling that my further mail after the tournament would be anyhow influenced by the results of the tournament - all I am about to say would be the very same today, after a week or a week ago, completely irrespective of the tournament results as well as which alliance I compete.
 
I'd also like to ask you, HM, to manage it to get through the mail you're replying to. Your own was quite long too and the person you speak with not only read the whole of it, but also addressed all the cetrain issues mentioned. Your reply is simply rude.
 
Cheers,
Boromir
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Createure View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 15:03
I like your measured approach Boromir. Though I already knew you had that after seeing you perform in this tourny. I look forward to reading your points later.

@Dakota: I agree 100% with Ryuuku/HM here. That response of yours is not a measured argument. It is an enormous tirade of denial. I read about half way and couldn't believe I was still nowhere near the end. You mentioned how much you like the "grind" though so I guess you probably enjoyed writing it more than I enjoyed reading half of it.

I will make 1 point though: Your point about H? using 'exploits' is just so unfounded it is quite absurd. The development team (those people who designed, run and OWN this game) have publicly stated that the tactic in question is a perfectly valid (and pretty cunning) tactic. By the very definition of exploit, it has to be something that the development team did not intend to happen. If the dev team dind't intend for NPC "locking" they wouldn't have written the code for that. QED.

Now whether the rest of Illyriad feels that Harmless using a cunning tactic to help themselves in this tourny is bad is a totally different question. Will people appluad a group for using brains over brawn or will they deplore H? for not playing the game on someone else's terms?

And I'll leave that to others to discuss. You already know where I stand.


Edited by Createure - 03 May 2011 at 15:06
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HonoredMule View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 17:17
Boromir, I have read and considered what you have had to say to my fellow directors, for you spoke well and intelligently even in your anger.  As for Dakota's post, I refer you both to our alliance profile.  "He who would speak, speak well and be heard."

I have no compunction to absorb a nearly endless wave of vitriol and sour grapes.  There is but one blindly asserted premise in the whole sermon anyway, that locking tiles is viciously evil for reasons completely unspecified.

While Harmless tires ever more of the taxing attention required to launch dozens of armies on a regular schedule not of our choosing, Valar's numerous ranks have been catalyzed by this event, redoubling their efforts and showing more consistent activity.  When this is over, you'll all have a very hard time explaining exactly what offense was committed other than making you work a little harder to keep your lead.  Sorry for presenting a challenge?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 17:29
If anything... 99% of diplo interference is directed against the top 4 VALAR players in this tournament anyways. Handicapping the 4% of the VALAR alliance that was providing 50% of their total parts simply forces you guys to work as a team instead of depending on 4 dedicated and skilled players to bring you free prizes.

Infact I would have alot more sympathy for Dakota's anger if he was one of those 4 players.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 17:35
HonoredMule, I am sorry if I hurt your feelings.  But you are acting like a typical politician that will not address an issue, when the facts are not on their side.  Instead of addressing the arguments I made in my post, where I addressed each of the points you made; you instead attack the messenger.

If all you can do is attack me, instead of the subject on hand, then you do not give much credence to your credibility.  However, all will think better of you, if you can actually address the points I have made.

And trying to make excuses, that because the Valar have redoubled our efforts to counter your tactics, does not mean no offense has occurred.  I wonder how you would react if someone other than yourself were to say that.  It would be like saying that it didn't matter that Nazi Germany bombed civilians in London, because they lost the war in the end, so no harm was done.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 17:37
Dakota, I'm going to do even better.  I'll let someone with a neutral point of view respond to you.

And Godwin...classy.
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Createure View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 17:50
I'm not even sure that we were having an argument.

But Dakota: You just lost it
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2011 at 20:04
To HM, Creature and the Mighty H? Alliance,
 
Just some quick comments :
 
a.  The legion-locker tactic is actually not a clever nor an effective tactic to clinch the advantage in this tournament.  It diverts an alliance's effort from hunting to locking the legions, in futility. Very much like the tactic of  setting encampments outside Boromir's cities to prevent the animal  spawns and similarly futile. Unless you have players who have the patience to saturate every possible square.
 
b.  I think that H? considered it "clever" when it thought that it had hegemony over the idea, during the time that it thought no one would else would be "clever" enough to think of the same.
 
c.   I personally welcomed H? resorting to such tactic because  for me, it misled them to believing that it will be able to turn the tide in its favor because of this "clever" idea, diverting necessary focus, wasting precious opportunity.  Well the tournment is not yet over, it may just turn the tide who knows only H? knows.
 
d.  But I could understand the disappointment of my VALAR buddies like Dakota, duQ and Boromir because they see the game from a deeper perspective which involves mechanics and rules and coherence. And H? resorting to the use of the tactic has disturbed such coherence and balance in the tournament. And it has allowed a questionable exploit to now become a normal acceptable thing in the game. So after the tournament, when we notice some non-disappearing legions in our neighborhood we just say "ah its okey somebody is just being kind enough to lock them there for days and days on end. Now lets track where they are coming from so that we could siege them out of the game."  And so gameplay  evolves in a way that we believe was never the intention.  Well I am exaggerating but I hope you get my gist....
 
e.  I will also agree with the observation that the tactic somehow solidified the Valar more and that in the end, we the Valar will look back at this opportunity of having locked horns with H? in this intellectual debate and the mental battles behind this tournament.
 
 
Cheers to you our worthy opponents!  Keep up the good hunt. The tournament is not yet done. 
 
:) 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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