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Time to make a seperate realm.

Printed From: Illyriad
Category: Miscellaneous
Forum Name: Suggestions & Game Enhancements
Forum Description: Got a great idea? A feature you'd like to see? Share it here!
URL: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=10508
Printed Date: 17 Oct 2018 at 04:10
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Time to make a seperate realm.
Posted By: Blueskree
Subject: Time to make a seperate realm.
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2018 at 11:06
Hello,
I'm writing this message to try and get a SECOND NEW Illyriad realm built into the game. I'm a veteran player who long ago has quit playing this game due to things being basically set in stone and never will change. I would return to this game if a NEW separate realm was made, that way those who are established can stay on their old realm and play by the same metrics and alliances ect.

One of the biggest reasons why I quit this game was I found that there was a lot of multi accounting going on and I found that very disheartening. In a game where troop build times are long and tedious and in a game like this where multi gaming is out right encouraged, via the "sitter" accounts where these accounts are perma sat. It really isn't fair as these old alliances are sitting on many perma sat accounts, and multi accounters use the sitter ability to easily manage their many accounts.


What I'm purposing is a second realm to be created where the Illyriad officals actually took out multi accounting and implemented a multi accounting algorithm. I would like to see the sitter option taken out as well all know that sitter accounts are not fair. By doing this I can guarantee increased revenue via prestige sales, as well as if marketed properly on Steam people would see a new realm and think "Oh wow this game isn't over a decade old" and they'd want to participate in it. By having a second realm those disenfranchised with the current game can go over to this one and build a new. But I want to see the multi accounters taken care of, cause imo thats what makes this game stale. When I played the game I spent over 150$ on prestige, and believe me by opening up a new realm you'll increase profit and see new players enter the game.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, hopefully one day you'll take my advice.



Replies:
Posted By: Bill Cipher
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2018 at 23:50
Hmm?

You say it will help the game but nothing about how it will happen?


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Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 03:15
Easy, all the Illyriad crew needs to do is transfer over the game minus the backup buddy system and implement some sort of multi-accounting detection system. They claim to have one right now but I think that's just a claim, just like a sign that hangs on an empty door that reads "Don't enter".
It would be very easy to transfer the game as it is into a new world exactly like the old one. It may need a few more resources on their server to host it. But trust me, do you think someone new who sees a game that's been around for over a decade will want to be apart of something that's already established? This gives the chance for new players and old to forge something new to make history. I love this game but I quit cause its impossible to compete with multi accounters when you have troop build ques that are static. Its impossible to counter someone who uses sitter accounts and on top of it their own multi-accounts.

All I'm asking is for a new realm to be made. Many online browser games have multiple "rounds" or "realms" going on at once. That way the people who are still invested will stay on the current realm and those who want to make something new can come to the new realm. Also if the owners of Illyriad were smart they'd email every single email on file letting them know that a new realm is starting that way it'll draw in old players who long ago quit. Cause Ive followed these forums for the past year and all the old vets speak of how unfair sitter accounts are and how it ruins things cause most of the old alliances are sitting on multiple accounts.

What does Illyriad have to lose from having a second realm? Nothing is the answer.


Posted By: Mr. Ubiquitous Feral
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 03:20
/me land claims the new realm

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I am a Machine.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 03:31
I'm going to explain how another browser game handles zero tolerance for multi accounting. Basically the players account accrue vacation credits, a free account gets about 10-14 days a year. A paying account gets about 21 days a year. In vacation mode a player does not accumulate resources and cannot be attacked. Vacation mode cannot be triggered if your being attacked. So that right there eliminates the need for a "sitter" looking after your account.

The game also has a strict programming that detects multi accounting. I don't know to much about the programming. But I imagine some players probably own multiple accounts here, if you don't live at home one could easily go to their parents house make an account there, then set one of their accounts as a sitter. Then do this twice as the game supports two accounts a main and an alt. SO basically right there you make an alt and a main and have your accounts sitting them. Prestige doesn't work on players overseeing sitter accounts so they cant rush things but an account can be very powerful if all they use it is for military purposes. I haven't played in over a year but I pursume most military players are still doing 8 city builds?


I have no problem with the ALT and the MAIN setup but the sitters is where it really destroys the integrity of the game.

But it wouldn't be hard to create a second realm, one of the most succesful browser game that makes millions a year has something like sixty realms running at once. Think of this GM's, more realms = more revenue. Give us a new realm without sitter accounts!


Posted By: eowan the short
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 03:49
Personally, I like the idea of a second realm.... definitely would be cool to see... especially with the possibilities of doing transfers of goods between realm A and realm B, for a fee of course.... and the varying exchange rates that could be set up between A and B....

Yeah... I'd certainly enjoy something like this... 

As for the sitters thing, I do like the idea of the limited vacation time... sounds like an interesting idea to combat long term sitting....




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This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some person started it, not knowing what it was, and we'll continue posting on it forever just because...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 03:57
Glad you like the idea Eowan. I personally don't want any transfers being able to take place in this second realm. The first and second realms should be totally non-related to each other.

Also if sitting accounts were taken out of the second realm it would make it really hard for people to multi-account as the rule should be "One main and one alt per device or IP address" So that way if someone wants to multi account they'd have to do it via their phone or travel to someone else's house to do this. That way it would eliminate players from having lets say two accounts open to them via their main, and two accounts via the alt through the sitter option.

Another option I would like to see, as I was a player with over 18 cities when I played. I would like to see the option of automation via the prestige usage tab. I was someone hauling resources here and there constantly via the hub or city. I would like see it set up where my caravans travel to my specific destination from point A to point B without me having to click on the caravan and type in the resource limit, that once the caravans arrive I can set it for them to move back and forth constantly. That should be included in the first and second realm. I don't care if its a free addition or one that requires prestige.


Posted By: Bill Cipher
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 04:05
What are you losing?

You are losing energy and effort just because its easy doesn't mean it will be quick (idk the time frame on that just a guess)

while there trying to create a new server which is  risk on if people actually join or not. It's more of people wanting new content not another server.

A new server isn't really new content just copy paste of the other server on a clean slate

I don't hate it i'm just looking at it from another perspective i guess


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Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 04:12
What am I losing? I'm not losing nothing as I don't play the game anymore, I got nothing to lose.
What do I have to gain? I got a lot to gain if they created a second server that eliminated multi accounting. Why would I want to play a game now that things are set in stone, people amassed billions and sit on prestige reserves.


Simple, give us who want to come back a reason to come back. I could come back but why would I? I quit cause of the fundamental flaw of the sitter accounts bring to this game as it currently sits.


And the time line could be within a 2-3 months. All thats required is to change the code, removing the sitter accounts and then opening a second server. The game could just be copied over keep the map the way it is with the functions it currently has. Then the multi accounting detection soft ware could be implemented in time.


Posted By: Bill Cipher
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 04:42
You do you but I don't get it.

I'd rather have DEVs work on new stuff then take time and energy to do this.

Nothing is going to be perfect deal with it


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Posted By: eowan the short
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 05:00
Just to be clear, when I say transfers, I don't mean a literal game mechanic for that, I mean a player created system.
For example;
Player X wants to get 100 million into realm B
They send the people running the transfer service some gold based on the exchange rate the transfer service has set up- how do they calculate this? who knows! But as there is less gold in the new realm, presumably the value of gold in the new realm is higher.
The transferers then take a small % of that gold as commission and send the player 100 mil in realm B.

So, yeah, Illy forex....




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This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some person started it, not knowing what it was, and we'll continue posting on it forever just because...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 05:43
Well I want to play in something totally new and void of previous Illyriad history. I also want to start on a clean slate where everyone is equals and has a chance to make their own history. That's alright if you don't get it, you don't have to get it. If they choose to create a second realm those who want to stay can stay and those who want to go can go, everyone has a choice. At least give us that choice.

IMO I've watched these forums for over a year now and I can say without playing the game that its dying. It was dying when I was playing it. But now that the SIN has disbanded, due to them burning them selves out. How can you defeat an enemy in this game which sits on "dummy" accounts? Like I said previously the way the troop system is in this game its impossible to beat people who use multi accounts. Anyways as I was saying, I've watched peoples farewell statements and their goodbyes and it all comes down to one thing that's strangling this game.... its the sitters and the multi accounting. Most of all the Crow's that left last year stated that. Reading the forum posts the SIN players spiced this game up, they really did.

You say you rather have the devs work on new stuff.... well let me say that most of the players that quit state remove sitter accounts, so please remove them. Also give us a second realm to start over again in. If the devs "make new stuff" and keep it the way it is their going to see their membership shrink even more, cause the new stuff is just putting lip stick on a rather ugly pig. It won't fix the issue, like how many people will it take over the years to say remove the sitter accounts before they listen? Maybe when they don't have a player base playing maybe they'll say we should've listened. Well this is your chance to remedy a lot that's wrong with this game.

Create a second realm with the features I've mentioned. Email everyone's email that has ever played telling them its a new and improved Illyraid 2.0 ect. And go on Steam and put the game on sale for Free and state that its a new chance Illyraid 2.0 ect ect and the players will come and we'll open up our wallets to buy prestige.


Posted By: Mr. Ubiquitous Feral
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 17:06
i've also been watching the forums and goodbye posts. Also listening in on the GC debates. The other point that keeps coming up is that people come and go and then more people come and go, they stay or leave because they want to. Blaming it on any single thing is no bueno. People are weird and they will find other reasons to quit even if Illy became perfect for every single player. Perhaps you could make an account, and do something to enhance the game? Eowan has done it, SIN did it, TCol is doing it. Come join the fun and quit complaining from the extreme sidelines.

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I am a Machine.


Posted By: Tensmoor
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 17:46
Originally posted by Mr. Ubiquitous Feral Mr. Ubiquitous Feral wrote:

i've also been watching the forums and goodbye posts. Also listening in on the GC debates. The other point that keeps coming up is that people come and go and then more people come and go, they stay or leave because they want to. Blaming it on any single thing is no bueno. People are weird and they will find other reasons to quit even if Illy became perfect for every single player. Perhaps you could make an account, and do something to enhance the game? Eowan has done it, SIN did it, TCol is doing it. Come join the fun and quit complaining from the extreme sidelines.

Couldn't agree more.


Posted By: eowan the short
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 18:56
If his point is invalid because he doesn't do things in game or add to it, then I'll copy and paste it and we can start again.

If the devs didn't want suggestions for game enhancements, they wouldn't have made a part of the forums specifically for suggestions.

Now, personally, I don't think a truly separate realm is possible. Similar players will be involved in both realms and as such similar political ties will emerge. But it would have the effect of the reset many like snot have called for without causing the damage that I believe a reset would cause.


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This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some person started it, not knowing what it was, and we'll continue posting on it forever just because...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2018 at 20:04
I agree Eowan that if they created a new realm that the players from the old one would come over and play a part in the new one. I however don't think that they would be as powerful in it like they are today. You have to realise that most of the power players in Illyriad today are sitting on years of accumulated wealth. Also some are sitting on abandoned accounts which they fleece like a lamb, as its totally in game legal to hold multiple accounts via the sitter feature.

All I'm asking is for a second server so those of us who want to play again can, and I want the sitters and multi accounting out of the game as it ruins the integrity of the game.

Personally I don't see what Illyriad the company has to lose by making a new realm. I do however see why some of the established community would be against the second realm, because it would mean them losing their position of power. They'd have to either come to the new realm and build up or sit on their old one. And I'd venture new players would be more inclined to join a new realm instead of one that's over a decade old. It all has to do with the "go out and venture your own future" or "play by the same old rules, with the same old establishment". So yes I understand why some would be against a new realm.


Posted By: rajput
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 00:41
I have very different take on all this...

#1 no account sitters... completely agree with that. Approve

#2 Foolproof inactive / abandoned account handling... ermmmm I'm ok with that to kinda. Ermm
Although I do have a compromise + super crazy Wacko idea, which will be complex to implement and it deserves separate thread. 

#3 Eliminate multi-accounting abuse... I am all for it. For browser based games that is a bit challenging to implement. But there are fingerprint algorithms which let one detect such activity up to >90% accuracy. And now a days online anonymity is big thing in tech world, any kind of traceable abilities are being removed actively.

#4 Seasoned vs Newbie... In order to resolve this issue (without creating new server/realm every now and then) is to implement some sort of league system. But I also believe that this will restrict some of the sandbox nature of the game...

#5 Server reset... Ummm Disapprove nope! You may have reached your finish line but some/allot of us have yet to reach ours. If you reset it those of us who are still making our way to finish line will get robbed of whatever progress we had made. Secondly, its not a race and there are no finish lines. Lastly, you are discounting the fact that everyone plays at his/her own availability and pace.

#6 2nd Realm... Geek This is a very technical question. Only devs can answer this. But most likely it is do-able, their might already be another isolated realm for developers. Now whether it should be done... Thumbs Down No. The argument of 'people will go after new realm just because its new' but is exact carbon-copy of old one... is not really an argument, for me at least. If you fix the above mentioned points, this point will have no need to exist.

#7 Multi-Lingual... This game need to be available in multiple languages and marketed accordingly. By keeping it in just English they are very much restricting their market base. 

#8 Portable/Small-screen UI... They need to develop a mobile/small screen UI for this game somehow. Currently the game is not very touch friendly. I struggle with it on my tablet as well. Mind you, there are more portable mobile devices on this planet then PCs. 

#9 Officially Cold... Officially they went cold and dark... Illyriad blog hasnt seen any update since 2016, full moon sighting is fairly routine then seeing any of officials on forum, their twitter is mostly stale. I am not sure about FB as I dont use it but more or less it will be same. They need to have an Official community moderator who is also active in game. That will give very good impression to new comers and a good moderator will always keep chattering going on GC.

#10 More Tournaments... To follow up on the above point, they need to increase the numbers and types of tournaments or contests. Quests system, sorry to say, has become joke now. There was a suggestion I made earlier, to allow community member to submit lores/scenarios/activities for quest. It may not be something that will interest the seasoned players, but new players will get something to occupy their time with and keep them interested.  

#11 Ching Ching! Bling Bling! Dolla Dolla!!!... If revenue/profitability is the issue, then there are number of possibilities including but not limited to incorporating Ads, going subscription based, associating with a bigger game development house, launching campaign, etc... Or sell it to someone (clue: look east)... This point is also tied to the next one...

#12 Mother-of-all-question or answer (whichever way you want to look at it)... What is current Illyriad vision? What are the goals? What is their motivation or ambition? What are the challenges? We dont know any of that and are just speculating. This point ties to all the points discussed above... All of us are coming from players-point of view but there is no Devs point of view...
and that is what I am interested in! Smile






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Posted By: eowan the short
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 01:05
I agree with you entirely with the exception of the following point:

Originally posted by rajput rajput wrote:


#6 2nd Realm... Geek This is a very technical question. Only devs can answer this. But most likely it is do-able, their might already be another isolated realm for developers. Now whether it should be done... Thumbs Down No. The argument of 'people will go after new realm just because its new' but is exact carbon-copy of old one... is not really an argument, for me at least. If you fix the above mentioned points, this point will have no need to exist.

The reason why people will go to the new realm is that it will be a leveled playing field. Currently, if you are a new player, you have to compete with the established alliances and players out there, people who have played for upwards of 8 years in some cases.

New power balances could be found on the new server and trade would suddenly become a lot more interesting as alliances won't be sat on huge stockpiles of materials. 


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This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some person started it, not knowing what it was, and we'll continue posting on it forever just because...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 01:45
Those are all good points, and my take on this game is roughly that thw company behind it is perfectly happy keeping it the way it is. Even if its playership continues to decline, which it will. Its from that point of view that keeps me from replaying this game. I remember reading about a year ago that the owners of Illyriad are from the United Kingdom and they receive grant money from the British government. So maybe their happy just collecting the government's money and leaving the game the way it is.

Once again Ill state that I want something new to play on free of multi accounters, and i guarantee old player bases will return or even a new player base rerurns once a new server gets created. Do i think one will get created? Highly unlikely that it will. But i hope they prove me wrong.

Basically when people join the game they start off at 0 pop. And they grow them selves up, they look around and see oh cool player so and so has 43 cities and over a million population, and you look at your 1250 pop and go "yup not climbing that hill". I also know that some people in this game in the top 5 rankings use their hoarded money to recruit new players into alliances and then throw them to thw wolves. By creating a new server you take away the old players power away from them. So yes thats the allure of a new realm, a sense of a new start and a environment free of multies.


Posted By: rajput
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 11:18
I am not going to go into how they are running the company etc... unless Devs or a stake holder actively participate in this discussion. It is a private entity and as long as they are abiding by their local laws & regs... it is none of my/our concern. 
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Fair and balanced playing field in matured sandbox? 

Lets for a second consider that the ills like account sitting, multi-accounting, and abandoned/inactive accounts are dealt with properly. 

Even a new realm after 2 years will start to take shape much like this one... You cannot discount experience, knowledge, productivity, and seniority in a sandbox. Those in my opinion are the challenges which players have to overcome and is much like real-life. If you try to restrict that by either reducing the realm play period or by introducing illogical restrictive mechanisms then it is no longer a true sandbox... It will become more like a very linear arcade game.

Another thing, once you start going down that road, there will come a day someone will be asking for new realm just after 6 months. And then there will be a realm every tournament like some games already out there.

Even on new realm old/seasoned players will still have advantage over new players, although they do not come with resources, they will have knowledge and experience. If devs carbon-copy this realm then they also have knowledge of all sweet spots, tactics, and strategies.

In general terms, everything has a life-cycle, and there is/will-be one in Illy as well. Old will fade (sometime super slowly) and new will shine. That's how it has been and will remain.


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Posted By: eowan the short
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 12:15

Of course in two years or so, it would start to settle down much in the same way the current server has but it will likely settle down differently as different groups will have different abilities to adapt to various situations. 

Additionally, today's trade is, frankly, stale. There are people out there who on their own are sitting on more cows than get traded in 3 months through centrum.... and those are just individuals, imagine what an alliance could do.... 8 years of building has caused abundance and where's the fun in that? People aren't even vaguely efficient with their trades *because they don't need to be*. Why argue over 25 mil here or there when you have 10bn in a hub? But, in a new server where this abundance hasn't taken hold, trade has the potential to be much more interesting.

And, yes, this might only last a couple of years but that's a couple of **years**. Even in illy, that's a long time.

Now, I also take issue with your point that opening new servers will lead to more servers being opened more regularly in the future and this is for the following 3 reasons:

1) I feel it is too close to being a slippery slope fallacy

2) The devs have previously added a second continent but I see few people actively asking for more land to be created.

3) Would opening more servers even be a bad thing? The devs will only open it if they get more money from it than it costs and if they think it'll cause profit then.... I don't see the downside... If the game gets more money that means it'll be around for longer and have the potential of getting additional staff put on it to develop it. 


On a separate note, I do agree with the idea that the running of the Illyriad company has nothing to do with us. 


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This is the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friend. Some person started it, not knowing what it was, and we'll continue posting on it forever just because...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2018 at 22:49
"Even a new realm after 2 years will start to take shape much like this one... You cannot discount experience, knowledge, productivity, and seniority in a sandbox. Those in my opinion are the challenges which players have to overcome and is much like real-life".

Just reading that statement made me think of the Russian Revolution of 1917 when the people decided that they had enough of living under Czarist Romanov rule for over 300 years, and chose communism. Lots of people in the game and new comers will never be able to achieve a level that some of the more experienced players have achieved. If the devs develop a second realm and it turns out to be exactly like the one it is now than at least we were given an option on how it would turn out. At least we were given the chance to play on a second realm, to shape it into what ever the players wanted it to be. I personally don't think it'll end up the same way it is now, sure you'll have alliances from the other realm coming over trying to make it the same. But I assure you you'll have countering forces that want to see the game play out differently. That was one of the goals of the SIN was to destroy the alliance power structure and destroy sitter accounts. See there is a lot of will of the player base to change things, the problem is that that player base gave up and quit the game. Once again I state it is impossible to beat an enemy that has unlimited resources due to either having many sitter accounts or just through years of stockpiling. If this games mechanics were different and one could rush build troops maybe it would be different. But no there was once a will to change the game, read the farewells, read the war declarations of the SIN and you'll see there was once the will.

A new server free of sitters and multi-accounting will bring the will of some of the people to light. I also suspect as I've said before lots of old players will return to this game if notified of the chances and that a new realm opened up.

For those of you already established or are perfectly happy playing with sitter accounts, ect ect. You have the choice to stay on the old realm. No one will force you to come over to the new one. And a second realm will not degrade the game in anyway, it will only enhance it.


Please dev's open a new realm free of sitter accounts, implement a vacation mode in the game, and beef up anti accounting to protect the integrity of the game.


Posted By: Ten Kulch
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2018 at 03:38
The persistent world is a major feature of Illyriad. If a new server started, effectively making this one obselete, then I think far more players would just find a new game entirely. The game population has been in steady decline for years, and the number of players has probably declined more than the number of accounts (due to password transfers). A reboot could easily be a deathblow to a fragile community.

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Check out my blog, http://illywarmonger.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow - Warmongering in Illyriad for self-defense techniques, military city construction, and PvP strategies.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2018 at 04:10
It wouldn't be a reboot. Players can still play on the original one and play on the second one. It would still be persistent because it wouldn't be going any where.
I think where the apprehension lies is that most of the players know a second server would render the original obsolete, which it would. Its like the old dog you've had for years and all a sudden theres a brand new puppy and everyone wants to play with the brand new puppy cause its new and fresh. So i understand why people who have lots to lose wouldn't want it to go through. Just ask your self one question, are you fine with Illyriad deteriorating until maybe 100 players are left, or do you want to take a chance and see if this can kick start Illyriad again.
Like i said the choice is yours to stay on the original if there were to be a second server created, the persistencey wouldn't be lost.


Posted By: rajput
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2018 at 20:23
Originally posted by eowan the short eowan the short wrote:


2) The devs have previously added a second continent but I see few people actively asking for more land to be created.


Yes, you are right, I see zero (big 0) people asking for new expansion of land, because below is quote from a GM discussing the reason(s) for BL implementation. Opening up a new server and land expansion are completely different things at many levels.

Originally posted by GM Stormcrow GM Stormcrow wrote:

Hi all,

Just wanted to bring you all up-to-speed on changes to our planned release of the Broken Lands expansion to Illyriad.

There are a number of things to run through here, so please bear with me.

New player influx
We've recently had a large influx of new players, and Elgea is now getting pretty full.  Finding an unsettled area on Elgea for new alliances is proving extremely difficult, and I don't think anyone will doubt that all the "best" locations are pretty much taken.

We want to expand the landmass, and implementing our original plan for the Broken Lands - where, essentially, everyone in the game could start again from scratch with a further 2 pairs of 10 cities on another continent - isn't really a solution to this issue.

Full source thread here > https://forum.illyriad.co.uk/25may14-broken-lands-update_topic5603.html

Personally it would be fun if some crashed the cow market by dumping cheap cows... MOOooos Gone Wild Tongue...





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Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 00:16
"where, essentially, everyone in the game could start again from scratch".

I see how in the technical term the Dev could have used the term "start again from scratch" as one would have to move down to this landmass and begin a new. In one way it was like declaring bankruptcy, you personally get to start a new but the rich people and the banks still get to keep what they've already made.
Like I said before I'm looking for a Russian Revolution of 1917, I want a new server free of the years of build up and free of sitter accounts. I don't want an "essentially, everyone in the game could start again from scratch". I want a definate everyone in the game WILL start again from scratch.


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 01:00
Until they get this age of ascent delusions of grandeur out of their system there will be stuff all happening on illyriad. the only change they made was to make it possible for dedicated players to spend more cash money to trade prestige. i.e. multi accounting can only be abolished at a financial cost which they can't afford.  the game barely makes any money. whatever comes in is spent and it isn't on development of illyriad. perhaps they are trying to earn enough to pay back the people who funded them in the first place - who knows? for sure the lack of communication on both illyriad and on aoa is shocking. i still play but i don't put cash into something that has no active development. they have only themselves to blame.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 01:22
Couldn't agree with you more Dungshovel. That's why I decided to cut my losses and quit playing the game. I have no problem with the financial support, it was that it had so many fundamental flaws that I didn't want to "waste" my time on this game. I could careless if they never developed this game further and let it sit the way it is. The only thing I care about is getting a new realm with the sitters and the multi-gamers out. Cause those ruined the game for me, so I want them gone. I also want a clean slate to play on free of the benefits that sitters and multi-accounting gave the old player base.

I personally think they have this game paid for, I said in a previous post that I think the company behind Illyriad is just happy collecting their government grant money. I could read up on exactly the statue that they receive their money for and the merit behind it. But if I had to venture I'm guessing when their grant comes up for renewal they tell the government we have X amount of players playing the game (sitter accounts included, and multi-accounts) that way it makes it look a lot better that the government isn't funding some dead beat game. That's the only reason why I can think of them imo abandoning this game. Idk how many people gotta quit and make statements before they realise that the sitters have to go. I could totally be wrong though, but I believe they're happy collecting the government money. Here Ill spend the next few hours researching the grant that they receive their money from. If I could find out which programme it falls under I could phone the ministry and ask them for a financial copy to see how much the company receives from the British government, it should all be public knowledge as its tax payers dollars and has to be accounted for.

But yeah I'm not playing a game where I knowingly know its not going to change. I suppose I could start playing again, create 8 accounts and become what I hate. Guess the old adage goes, if you cant beat em join em!


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 01:50
The "game" was probably paid for by the £100k odd they raised in equity in 2012(?) and then spent. The accumulated P&L is around -£100k (?) and they used research and development tax credits (cash refunds from HMRC) to stretch out the development money. Somewhere along the line they decided not to develop illyriad but AOA instead. The owner (major shareholder) is some kind of dreamer imho. I can't be bothered to remember ALL the details but its there on companies house beta in the UK.  The only unknown is from where the money came for AOA but answer may lie in property as the director moved addresses at some point and property deeds can be searched in the UK for a fee. But in the words of Vicky Pollard, Am I bothered?


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 03:32
Yah who knows whats going on with the company. All i know is they took a hands off approach to the game. Which would be fine if thats what the player base wanted, but it isn't what they want.
I dunno maybe i should've asked for a new server two years ago. Now this game kinda seems dead and unless they do something in the next six montha i might just thank them for the time i did have and move on. No use fighting something which won't change.


Posted By: Mr. Ubiquitous Feral
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 05:36
Devs... please give this guy his own server so he will end this thread.    thank you.

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I am a Machine.


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 11:09
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IPp9StSn-Q%20" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IPp9StSn-Q

Interview with the CTO of Illyriad Games in Prague in May 2018.

Interestingly enough at 31/03/16 when the annual return included a list of shareholders it was clear that Niesewand owned a controlling interest but that the CTO didn't seem to own any equity.  Still if he can get to a conference abroad, there is some money somewhere. It's just not allocated to Illyriad.

I'm not going to pass any comment on the interview.  People can make their own minds up.


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 11:19
Originally posted by Ten Kulch Ten Kulch wrote:

The persistent world is a major feature of Illyriad. If a new server started, effectively making this one obselete, then I think far more players would just find a new game entirely. The game population has been in steady decline for years, and the number of players has probably declined more than the number of accounts (due to password transfers). A reboot could easily be a deathblow to a fragile community.

I agree.
The non zero accounts are now around 4,000 players.  It used to be 5,000 players.


Posted By: TomBombadil
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 12:59
Creating a 2nd server on the same scale would just split the playerbase, not the best idea at this time. I don't think you guys realise just how much prime real estate there is available in Illy right now and how quickly you can grow your account to a competitive level if you play with that aim in mind.

I would, however, like a 2nd much much smaller server that resets every 6 months or so. In which new ideas can be experimented with without risking bad repercussions on the main server. This also has the appeal of luring in new players looking for the more combative type play and creates a good turnover for the more peaceful farmville minded players who currently like to hang out in Illy, and giving old established player the chance to build up from scratch and test their strategies. Best of both worlds.
I'd even suggest playing with the same account on both servers, with the end of server war prizes heading back into Illy in the form of medals or special units or even just cosmetic city skins for the victors, which would encourage activity on both servers.
Think of it as a tournament server.

This also has the financial benefit of holding onto both farmville and travian style players, instead of splitting the player base in two.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 13:11
Dungs, your like a investigative journalist haha.
Ok so on one hand we could have a second server that could bring new life to the game, and on the other hand it could be the final deathblow to the game. So we have to ask our selves, if the state of the game is in decay which we all can agree on. What does the game have to lose by creating a second server? At the worst the game suffers a quick death, at the best it regenerates the health of the game.
So basically i dont see a drawback from having a second server.
As it stands this game is in decay i think we can agree on that. It would be nice to hear the remaining player bases views and thwir ideas on how to improve the game. If the devs dont think then at least we tried to make Illyriad a better place.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 13:18
Tom, good idea's. I would play a six month reset server. However i vowed NEVER to play illyriad on the current server again. Taking from your idea, if they created a second server minus sitters and let people from the first and second servers playing in tournament server rounds(the reset rounds) with rewards going to either of the two realms that would be cool.
Basically the reset server could keep track of players income, damage, pop growth, trade, ect ect and keep a file on their stats how they did in each tournament realm rounds. That would be really sweet. Id even play without a second server if my profile was showed some where other than the illyriad server. I just wanna play something illyriad like without the multies ruining the game for me.


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 18:41
About 20% of active accounts have disappeared.  Sadly, I don't get the impression either you or I will be the straw that broke the camel's back.  Illyriad is clearly dead. AoA may be launched in 2018 but their track record for actrually delivering is bad.  Their CTO seems very interested in the technical side of AoA but that doesn't equate to actually launching a game.  If AoA is interesting, it will draw away custom from Illyriad even more. If it launches.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 00:25
Maybe i got lucky and got out of the game when the getting out was good.
What ia this new game they're developing? I can't even find a website for these guys, on the about illyriad games inc. Statement it says right on there Illyriad is their only game... I thought they came out with a space game a year or two ago? But what is AoA? Is it another medieval game too?


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 00:31
age of ascent - space game in development...


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 03:33
Ok thanks, I thought they had released that game already guess not. Looks like there hasn't been any new announcements on that game in about 7 or 8 months so the development is really slow.

I think where this game went wrong was that they ignored the requests of the players to update the game and to remove sitter accounts. When the game released on Steam they should have made the game free to the new players since its basically free via their website. Another problem is that like any game thats been on the market for a long time is that the player base gets bored and moves on from the game. So you can't blame that on the lack of development or on anyone factor. Maybe Illyriad has finally ran its course and the small group of players that do remain will continue to enjoy the game in its current state.


Posted By: Thexion
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 05:17
I doubt devs have time for making other realms. I probably would quit if they started to do that because Illyriad itself is still incomplete currently missing many features. To make another incomplete realm competing incoming from new players, while making AoA at the same time would be too much for me to watch and to put my time/money to the game.


Posted By: Lumelthien
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 14:43
I don't have any elaborate arguments, and I certainly make no pretense of having game-development or business expertise. But just from the standpoint of a player, I would very much so enjoy a new "realm" in Illyriad. I think it would be fun to settle an entirely new map with new landscape graphics and great resource spreads in interesting locations.

And frankly, I would still like to see at least part of that new map to be what BL was once supposed to be: a non-pvp area where all of us "farmers" can have fun as we see fit.


Posted By: Lumelthien
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 15:02
Originally posted by Dungshoveleux Dungshoveleux wrote:

Illyriad is clearly dead.


I find it difficult to believe that this type of game is enjoyable for very many people. It's slow, tedious, and just not particularly compelling. There was clearly a "golden age" for the game, where a lot of folks had fun interacting with each other and creating an interesting community. But as more and more of that core of players has moved on, I don't think any other group has particularly replaced them. And given the small audience this game will appeal to anyway, such a group will be hard to attract in the future. I think Illy got lucky.

Along the way, players have constantly wanted to change the game to make it more appealing. Sadly, the devs made promises that they were unable to keep. But in all of that, I think what was truly missing is that the slow pace of the game is the one factor that will always undermine it.

I suppose this is just a long-winded way of agreeing with you.




Posted By: Lumelthien
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 15:17
Excuse all the posts, but just one more thing:

The warmongers morphed this community from a fun, friendly, outgoing bunch of players to one that grew ever more angry, frustrated, and vengeful. Anyone who used to be around knows full well that "the community" was the number one reason the vast majority of the biggest and brightest players played. Killing that community helped to kill the game. And simply adding a new map will not bring back that community by itself.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 16:04
That would be a cool addition to the game where the farmville players could be safe. I know if the devs did create a new realm I would create an alliance based on NATO where we were a peaceful alliance until attacked then the whole alliance gets drawed onto war. That way we could protect those who wanted to play farmville. One addition though i would like to see is the adjustment of alliance taxs, where instead of the whole alliance paying the same % you could tax your warriors at 0% as they're the fighters and you could tax the farmers at like 3% and it would be even cooler if you could choose which players could receive money instead of it just going to the alliance leader.
I think the reason why they haven't been able to recruit as many new players is cause they see a world which has ran its course. A new realm would give incentive to new players to play since its all new. People play retro games all the time, the age of the game isnt the issue. The issue is firstly give people a fresh start, and take away sitters and multis cause imo thats cheating and that crap ruins the game for those hard workers who follow the rules to just have everything destroyed by people who have over 10 accounts.
The problem with the war people as you mentioned was the members of the SIN basically terrorized Illyriad. They claimed to want to rid the game of multis and sitted accounts. Reading their posts i was just like wow these guys are horrible at diplomacy. Firstly if they would have united the player base that wished to see the sitter accounts burned instead of being the equivalent of the nazi regime, i think they could've achieved their goals. But instead you had them try and impose a set price on silver steel. Then you had them say if someone left their alliance that was at war with them they'd hunt you down and burn you. Then i remember reading one post from a noob who got completely destroyed by them cause their alliance leader declared war on SIN so naturally they gotta hunt this poor feller down who doesn't even have a 5K pop. Then i remember them demanding sitter rights from one enemy and the devs saying oh yah thats cool, players direct the game. I was like what the hell. Anyways i could list about 15 more things the sin did, they didn't help them selves out at all in the eyes of the population. When you have policies of bunt and destroy noobs at any cost people read and see that and they don't want to be apart of that. Illyriad takes so long to build up in, and the players who have been playing for years can knock you down in days when you spent 6 months or more building up.
So ya the warring community probably did scare off some new players. I think if they marketed this game as a farmville it would do really well. Maybe have a server where its farmville then another where its normal illyriad. I dont even know at this point.


Posted By: Mr. Ubiquitous Feral
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2018 at 04:23
It doesn't matter anymore, you don't play. 

Illy was written years ago with different code from what is used in AoA. It seems that turning Illy into a new game would be like driving an old volkswagon into a junkyard and hoping it turns into a mercedes benz.  If you don't like the game, do something about it. Or better yet, end the thread and go to another game.

If you care to look for it, you will find the devs have already told us enough to answer the 'when' questions.

now give me a dollar. then go away.


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I am a Machine.


Posted By: DeliciousJosh
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2018 at 12:02
Having a safe-zone in Illyriad will imbalance the trade market, as well as make some players invincible. 

Players will claim as much land as possible in the safe-zone. Then they will farm like hell there, whilst having other options in the PvP area and the ability to always have reimbursement from their safe-zone.

Doesn't work.

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PublicRelations
HumanResources


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2018 at 19:38
You could have a pvp realm and a pve realm. In the pvp realm things are the same as normal Illyriad minus the sitter accounts. And in the pve realm war is strictly banned. Only time you can use war units is for attacking npc's or to defend your npc kills.


Posted By: Dungshoveleux
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2018 at 21:45
Originally posted by Lumelthien Lumelthien wrote:

Originally posted by Dungshoveleux Dungshoveleux wrote:

Illyriad is clearly dead.


I find it difficult to believe that this type of game is enjoyable for very many people. It's slow, tedious, and just not particularly compelling. There was clearly a "golden age" for the game, where a lot of folks had fun interacting with each other and creating an interesting community. But as more and more of that core of players has moved on, I don't think any other group has particularly replaced them. And given the small audience this game will appeal to anyway, such a group will be hard to attract in the future. I think Illy got lucky.

Along the way, players have constantly wanted to change the game to make it more appealing. Sadly, the devs made promises that they were unable to keep. But in all of that, I think what was truly missing is that the slow pace of the game is the one factor that will always undermine it.

I suppose this is just a long-winded way of agreeing with you.



Yes


Posted By: Ten Kulch
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2018 at 02:42
I suppose that no soapbox about What To Do About Illyriad (TM) would be complete without a misplaced rant about how SINdicate destroyed the game. In its entire multiyear history, the SINdicate probably destroyed less than 0.25% of the cities in the game. Yes, it did bring enormous military and political pressure on certain adversaries, causing their alliances to disband, but the vast (meaning 95% minimum) majority of those players of those defunct guilds went on to join other alliances and continue playing. The actual destruction is minuscule compared to the mythical level of fear.

Luckily now the SINdicate is gone, so the server can enjoy a huge muggle renaissance. Huzzah.

I'd like to predict now that there won't be a rebirth. There is not much demand for a click-focused browser game with minimal animation in the age of smartphones and tablets. The devs would be reckless to tamper with Illyriad too much. It still has 3000-4000 accounts, some of which probably still purchase prestige to keep the servers running. As long as Illy lives, they can credit themselves with running an award-winning Grand Strategy game that is part of the Steam platform. That is actually a valuable career and marketing asset, even if the game isn't the next Fortnite. There is a lot to be said for keeping a game running for seven years. While armchair quarterbacks can have pet theories about massive changes that should be attempted, there is a lot of cost and risk in a move like that, with potentially very little reward. There is very little cost and risk to maintaining the status quo, considering that Illyriad is a modest commercial success with some great press, and it probably requires minimal effort to do ongoing maintenance and make the occasional small change.

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Check out my blog, http://illywarmonger.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow - Warmongering in Illyriad for self-defense techniques, military city construction, and PvP strategies.


Posted By: Blueskree
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2018 at 03:30
I didn't say the Sindicate destroyed the game, just that they could've achieved their goals of destroying the sitted accounts had they been more welcoming and "friendly".
Well from what I gather from this forum topic is that there is a consensus that the game is dying or at the very least stagnant but there isn't the will to change it. Seems like most everyone is happy playing the same old same old, wouldn't want to upset the "persistent" part of the game.

I agree with you Ten Kulch that the developers will probably keep the game the way it is until it has 0 active accounts. I think there will always be certain players who play just cause they have to much to lose by not playing. Sad really that the majority of players think that having multiple servers is bad for business.
Anyways I said all that I gotta say now, I'll check the forums for the next few months in anticipation of a second realm being announced!


Posted By: rajput
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2018 at 17:49
Originally posted by Ten Kulch Ten Kulch wrote:

I'd like to predict now that there won't be a rebirth. There is not much demand for a click-focused browser game with minimal animation in the age of smartphones and tablets. The devs would be reckless to tamper with Illyriad too much. It still has 3000-4000 accounts, some of which probably still purchase prestige to keep the servers running. As long as Illy lives, they can credit themselves with running an award-winning Grand Strategy game that is part of the Steam platform. That is actually a valuable career and marketing asset, even if the game isn't the next Fortnite. There is a lot to be said for keeping a game running for seven years. While armchair quarterbacks can have pet theories about massive changes that should be attempted, there is a lot of cost and risk in a move like that, with potentially very little reward. There is very little cost and risk to maintaining the status quo, considering that Illyriad is a modest commercial success with some great press, and it probably requires minimal effort to do ongoing maintenance and make the occasional small change.
  
You Nailed it there

Same goes for AoA its an ultra MMO Space Sim game being developed on Azure + .Net platform. If it ever goes into production. It will be a showcase (or be a technology demonstrator) for Illyriad Games along with the fella in the Youtube video that was posted earlier (he looks like GM ThunderCat to me) as well as Azure and Microsoft with it.

You can see it also featured on Azure Gaming solution page from Microsoft ( http://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/solutions/gaming/" rel="nofollow - Link Here ).


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Posted By: Snagglepuss
Date Posted: 09 Aug 2018 at 01:42
You hated multi accounts but want to open a new server where those accounts can go hide without fear of attack... wow you really thought that one through eh?



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