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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2011 at 21:26
Createure, there are always "Haters" out there.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2011 at 21:43
You mean.... Haters be Hatin'...?

Wow... my mind is blow... now I have to go to the pub and stop refreshing this forum. Beer
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2011 at 23:49
Originally posted by Aneirin Aneirin wrote:


Also in this thread Storrmcrow now asserts that it has always been King Sigurd's intention to promote hostility between the alliances and indicates that this and future tournaments are to be viewed as a means to achieve this. I must confess that is news to me but as in all things if Stormcrow states it - then it must be true.

So be it.

I know that there are leaders out there who had different hopes for thier alliances. Indeed one wrote to me yesterday saying that his alliance weren't competetive and didn't want to be the best they just wanted to "have a fruendly atmosphere". Fat chance of that then, because King Sigurd and GM Stormcrow want you to be hostile to each other


Hi Aneirin,

This has ended up being a longer post than I originally thought it would be - but there are some serious issues to address here.

Firstly, I'm not asserting this or that - I'm simply stating the fact of King Sigurd's original post.

On a slightly deeper note, you should really separate ingame RL people (like me, GM Stormcrow) from purely fictional characters (like King Sigurd) or Factions (like the Council of Illyria).  If you read the Lore you'll realise (as many of the excellent writers in the Fiction forum have) that King Sigurd is not the only mouthpiece of Illyria, and in fact has himself many threats and challenges to overcome from other factions (such as the Undying Flame faction).

We (the dev and content team) have a set of progressing and growing storyarcs involving the ingame fictional characters and factions, and the way they inter-relate.  These storyarcs will become clearer over time as we release Faction AI, Faction standings and Faction Quests; but *definitely* do not conflate King Sigurd's goals with the dev team's goals. 

Where we're headed to is that these factions are independent entities, written and story-arced by our (amazingly good) content writers.

There is every likelihood that the next "official" tournament will be run by the Blood Reavers, or by the Outlaws, or indeed, any other faction who is present ingame, and there will be faction standing implications for participation on one or either side.

So, simply because King Sigurd likes mayhem, intrigue and "sneaky tactics" does *absolutely not* mean that all tournaments will be run this way in the future.  Other factions will have other philosophies on what is "acceptable" behaviour, and I expect these will come through strongly in the rules of future tournaments, and it will, of course, be up to you as individuals or alliances if you wish to participate in them or not.

Ignoring the ingame faction side for a moment, though, and addressing the core gameplay philosophy we have at Illyriad...

Well Gosh and Blimey.

Of course
we want to produce areas of friction between players and alliances.,,

If you don't want *any* possibility of friction between players and alliances then there are tons of games I can suggest that might be more suited to your temperament. Most of these suggestions aren't MMOs, because, well, when you put people together in realtime you *inevitably* get friction - unless you're playing Hello Kitty Online ofc (a game that I truly enjoy btw in case you think I'm being facetious - perhaps ThunderCat can post a photo of my HK diamante-encrusted pink and purple mouse?).

But back to Illy..

We don't want players to be *forced* into the whole intrigue/diplomacy/combat arena, and there are (I'm very glad to say) many players who stay out of the whole alliance politics and diplomacy arena without any comeback. 

I expect, however, that the further players put their heads 'above the parapet' by their actions (be those military actions, trade actions, diplo actions, GC comments or whatever), the more likely they are to be "involved" in the game, whether that further involvement is what they wished or not: it's the nature of social interaction.

We will certainly be providing more methods for players to put their heads over that parapet in the future.  Players can choose the form and style of this emergence into the glare of Illyriad as they see fit; but sometimes they won't be able to choose this for themselves depending on who they fall afoul of and why - and that's not really for us (as devs) to prescribe.

This is, in a nutshell, what we believe a sandbox game is.

If I had to write it down as an equation, I'd say something like:

MMO + Sandbox = (Social Interaction) x (Game Toolset + Environmental Catalysts)

^^ This equation is crap, btw, just wanted to let you know ;)

However, our job - as devs in a sandbox game - is to provide a toolset for players to use as they see fit.  Sometimes you'll agree with the way or the direction/method in which these tools are used, and sometime you'll disagree.

That, however, is simply not our concern unless it threatens the very fabric of the gameworld - in which case we'll step in and change things.

To conclude my overly long post:

Illyriad is a sandbox.   We like intrigue, politics, diplomacy, subtlety.  We also like full on war, sieging and destruction.   We also like peace, trade, questing and NPC interaction.  In fact, we like everything about the game, generally.  What we mostly like, though, are the game mechanics that allow all these things to occur, and we like the players to apply these different "modes" as they wish - and for the players/alliances to balance themselves. 

Sure, there are game areas we can improve on, but our watchword/motto is "There is no game content that we can produce that is as compelling as what the players themselves produce". 

We can build toolsets, and we can create catalysts, but it's up to you people to make of them what you will, for better or for worse.

People sometimes ask why there aren't many inter-alliance wars in the top X of the alliance rank hierarchy, and shouldn't we make day-to-day things more warlike?

My answer is invariably "no" - this is a very "real" gameworld in many ways. You can lose the cities that you spent months building in a matter of days if you get it wrong strategically and tactically.  The overt war "detente" at the top is a reflection of the global reality of the Illyriad gamebalance - but do not *for a minute* think that this means it's peace and Hello Kitty Online at the top; there's as much spying, intrigue, politicking and metagaming (and indeed underhand tactics such as the last tournament, or overtly warlike destruction as in the tournament before it) going on each and every day between "friendly" alliances.  When it spills into actual war then that's the buttock-clenching moment everyone dreads because it really can be win-all or lose-all if you don't have the skills to come out on top.

Apologies for a long post here, but a few things I wanted to get across!

Best,

SC
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 00:19
Originally posted by GM Stormcrow GM Stormcrow wrote:

 If you don't want *any* possibility of friction between players and alliances then there are tons of games I can suggest that might be more suited to your temperament. Most of these suggestions aren't MMOs, because, well, when you put people together in realtime you *inevitably* get friction - unless you're playing Hello Kitty Online ofc (a game that I truly enjoy btw in case you think I'm being facetious - perhaps ThunderCat can post a photo of my HK diamante-encrusted pink and purple mouse?).
 <-- Exhibit A Confused

Edited by GM ThunderCat - 12 May 2011 at 00:20
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 00:25
I loved reading that in-depth post on the Illy sandbox philosophy...

...but I love that diamante-encrusted pink and purple mouse more.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 00:25
Originally posted by GM ThunderCat GM ThunderCat wrote:

Originally posted by GM Stormcrow GM Stormcrow wrote:

 If you don't want *any* possibility of friction between players and alliances then there are tons of games I can suggest that might be more suited to your temperament. Most of these suggestions aren't MMOs, because, well, when you put people together in realtime you *inevitably* get friction - unless you're playing Hello Kitty Online ofc (a game that I truly enjoy btw in case you think I'm being facetious - perhaps ThunderCat can post a photo of my HK diamante-encrusted pink and purple mouse?).
 <-- Exhibit A Confused


well thats cute! 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 00:40


I weep for the future.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 01:34
Originally posted by Llyorn Of Jaensch Llyorn Of Jaensch wrote:



I weep for the future.




Me too. And not because of my truly awesome mouse either :)

SC

PS. I had no idea TC had that pic on tap - I thought there'd be more srsbznz responses first: darn you TC!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 03:18
"actual war then that's the buttock-clenching moment everyone dreads "
 
Yikes!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2011 at 03:20
The thing about a sandbox is:
Sand
Ants
Wind blown sand
sand in my shoes
sand in my eyes
sand in my shorts
sand everywhere
sand tomorrow
never-ending sand
sand
sand
 
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