Play Now Login Create Account
illyriad
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - How Much Should It Cost To Start An Alliance?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

How Much Should It Cost To Start An Alliance?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 345
Poll Question: How much should it cost to start an alliance?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
9 [30.00%]
1 [3.33%]
1 [3.33%]
2 [6.67%]
4 [13.33%]
1 [3.33%]
1 [3.33%]
11 [36.67%]
You can not vote in this poll

Author
eowan the short View Drop Down
Postmaster
Postmaster
Avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2016
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 576
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eowan the short Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 03:38
I would say a good alliance is one that supports its players and helps them learn how to play the game. However, I would not say a good alliance helps its players learn how to play the game in a prescribed manner
I do not think there is such a thing as a right way to play the game and alliance that attempted to limit its player's ability to follow alternative play styles would not be good. I would have thought that was obvious from the various play styles I have had fun with.

According to you, its already too late. So why not tell the devs to shut off the server right now? Personally, I think rather than accepting that all things come to an end and illy's reaching its end, we should be looking at staving off that end for as long as possible. I don't think we can bring illy back to its former size but I certainly think we can keep things ticking over for longer.

Why not answer the questions I posted whilst you are waiting for the lights to go out?

1) Why do you think that making an alliance should be a such a casual and short term goal in a game that is extremely long term?

2) How would you attempt to solve the new player retention issue in a manner that would take relatively little effort for the devs?

3) If new players do not need the support and guidance of larger and older players, why do training alliances exist?


Edited by eowan the short - 12 Apr 2018 at 03:39
Back to Top
Ten Kulch View Drop Down
Postmaster
Postmaster


Joined: 20 Jan 2017
Location: Fellandire
Status: Offline
Points: 678
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ten Kulch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 13:18
Originally posted by eowan the short eowan the short wrote:

According to you, its already too late. So why not tell the devs to shut off the server right now?

Because that fade might take years, and there could be fun left in the game over that time. There are valid entertainment and business reasons to keep the lights on.

Your questions:

1. Because making an alliance can be fun, and games are about fun. People tend to play games while they are enjoying them.

2. That is a very broad question. The kind of question answered by the owners in their business case, not by me in a forum post about the gold cost of founding an alliance.

3. Training alliances are one valid way to learn the game. Being self taught is another. I am not disputing the validity of training alliances, I am disputing that they are the only path to play the game "correctly".
Check out my blog, Warmongering in Illyriad for self-defense techniques, military city construction, and PvP strategies.
Back to Top
Thirion View Drop Down
New Poster
New Poster


Joined: 10 Apr 2018
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Thirion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 14:24
Quote 2) How would you attempt to solve the new player retention issue in a manner that would take relatively little effort for the devs?


Short version: Open a new server.

Long version: In my opinion this game has two big problems at the moment:

1) A lot of the long time players have experienced most of the content and/or have reached the goal they wanted to reach. Without new content, tournaments and wars are the only non-constant challenges and usually war against the same alliances gets boring after some time - thus there isn't that much content that keeps long time players motivated after some time.

2) New players join the game, start growing and then realize at some point that there are other players that are up to 7 years ahead with city development and resource/troup production and that it would take years to catch up and get to a similar level.

Starting a new, seperated server would give long-time players a reason to start again while still beeing able to play on the old accounts, players that quit might join again for the new / different experience and new players are not demotivated because everybody starts at zero.

And yes, a new server usually doesn't solve the long time issues but helps keeping players interested for a while.
Back to Top
Solanar View Drop Down
Forum Warrior
Forum Warrior
Avatar

Joined: 11 Jan 2015
Status: Offline
Points: 261
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Solanar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 17:23
I don't have firm metrics to validate that people who join all newb alliances have retention issues, but my perspective anecdotally says it is true. They aren't able to offer support via resources, advice, or sufficient activity levels to be of value to one another. It's hard enough to find full time zone activity within established alliances that have a critical mass of members. I've said in GC previously that when people give the advice to wait before joining an alliance, that my counter advice is just not to join all newb alliances, since they have nothing to offer.

That's not just illy though, the same nonsense happens in other MMO's that have low hurdles for guild/alliance/corporation/team creation. The best, most active people are made to feel guilty if they want to leave and sometimes quit the game rather than staying somewhere terrible or leaving and feeling like they abandoned their friends by moving to a better group. 
Back to Top
eowan the short View Drop Down
Postmaster
Postmaster
Avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2016
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 576
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eowan the short Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 17:48
Originally posted by Ten Kulch Ten Kulch wrote:

Originally posted by eowan the short eowan the short wrote:

According to you, its already too late. So why not tell the devs to shut off the server right now?

Because that fade might take years, and there could be fun left in the game over that time. There are valid entertainment and business reasons to keep the lights on.

Your questions:

1. Because making an alliance can be fun, and games are about fun. People tend to play games while they are enjoying them.

2. That is a very broad question. The kind of question answered by the owners in their business case, not by me in a forum post about the gold cost of founding an alliance.

3. Training alliances are one valid way to learn the game. Being self taught is another. I am not disputing the validity of training alliances, I am disputing that they are the only path to play the game "correctly".


1) Where is the fun in a game with no difficulty or progression? Using that logic, all new players should be spawned with enough gold and troops to fight a war because they might enjoy it. IMO, working for something is what games are about, be it a campaign in an RPG working to take down the main villain or progressing in an MMO like Illyriad


2) The main thrust behind the idea of the increased cost is to increase new player retention. Discussing ideas on how to increase new player retention on a thread such as this as a good a place as any. As for it being the dev's job to come up with new ideas for the game, if I remember correctly, you argued for a stronger death defy effect after the death defy patch. Why so content with the game now?

If they didn't want our input, then why did they make this section of the forums?

3) I haven't said they are the only correct way, I am just stating that they show people recognise that a new player can learn the game much more completely from vets than new players/ no one. 
Back to Top
Mr. Ubiquitous Feral View Drop Down
Forum Warrior
Forum Warrior
Avatar

Joined: 01 Jan 2011
Location: U.S.A.
Status: Offline
Points: 360
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr. Ubiquitous Feral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 19:10
Eowan, will you please just write a petition and quit this thread? Start a new thread suggesting that if we all started with 50 vans and could build a max of 150, then more newbs would stay in the game. You can do something about this ingame. Start a training alliance, bring in only newbs, and teach them to want to play. Easy as that, but hurry before it costs 100 million to start your alliance!
I am a Machine.
Back to Top
eowan the short View Drop Down
Postmaster
Postmaster
Avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2016
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 576
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eowan the short Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 19:29
lol,
I'd do that but as I'm double terraing, I have neither the account nor the stability to help new players properly.

As conversation is ongoing in this thread, I don't see why I shouldn't continue posting on it. Its not like there's anything else happening on the forums most of the time. 
Back to Top
King Sigerius View Drop Down
Greenhorn
Greenhorn


Joined: 11 Nov 2017
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 81
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote King Sigerius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2018 at 01:32
I too have noticed a lot of players that join smaller alliances in continuem abandon frequently. But I think the issue here is that the small alliances and players don't have much to do. The few things they can do are severely limited. Hunt/Craft/Trade repeat is pretty much the only thing to do in a non military account. Sure you can try making meta game stuff but without the game having any other things to do that can be difficult. On the topic of changing the cost of making an alliance, I think 5m is sufficient. 5m in disposable gold is a decent acheivement for a brand new player who didnt receive outside help. And for groups of people joining I'm sure that amount won't be hindering. 
Back to Top
eowan the short View Drop Down
Postmaster
Postmaster
Avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2016
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 576
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eowan the short Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2018 at 03:05
I agree, there should be more for new alliances in the game... perhaps some sort of meta game league of small alliances.... with competitions and tournaments etc arranged through it.... 

I might give that a go when I'm done with my gold push.
Back to Top
Dabrelis View Drop Down
Greenhorn
Greenhorn


Joined: 08 Jan 2018
Status: Offline
Points: 55
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dabrelis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2018 at 12:33
I have noticed that a lot of players who join bigger alliances abandon frequently :)
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 345
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.